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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 10
Roseburg, OR | I recently had a Lloydz cam, along with a Fuel Commander V, put into my 2009 Vision, expecting the 30% increase in hp that Lloydz advertises. Don't believe 'em. Dyno after showed 99 hp at the rear wheels, which is maybe 15-16% increase at best. Torque went up to 105, but for the money, I'm not a happy camper.  |
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Cruiser
Posts: 185
Rhode Island | What other mods have been done, high flow air filter, exhaust?
Jim |
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | I'm curious too. Also, I was looking for the 30% increase claim you mentioned that Lloydz advertises but didn't see anything. Did you do the dyno before installing the cams? I'm still running stock, but I always like to hear about the performance upgrades. One day I might want a little more umph in the seat of the pants....
Edited by varyder 2012-06-18 4:58 AM
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Tourer
Posts: 395
Moravia, IA | I did the Lloydz cams, Victory Fuel Controller and the Lloydz intake plate - I got a bit more than you but not a whole bunch.....103hp and 109ft/lbs torque.
I dont remember Lloyd promising me 30%.....and my bill was $1500 for the parts and the work, including a few maintenance issues that needed attention.....thats cheap for that much increase of HP. The HD guys spend 2x that money in search of decent HP and fall short most of the time. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 1109
| I'm thinking about installing the cams myself. I've noticed the hp increases tend to vary considerably. Aaron is right about the HD guys. A friend of mine is having cams,air filter and a remap done on a new ultra and while HD says he will be at 100hp I have other friends that did the same and 82-85 was the best they've seen. |
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Tourer
Posts: 395
Moravia, IA | kris1956 - 2012-06-18 5:38 AM
I'm thinking about installing the cams myself. I've noticed the hp increases tend to vary considerably. Aaron is right about the HD guys. A friend of mine is having cams,air filter and a remap done on a new ultra and while HD says he will be at 100hp I have other friends that did the same and 82-85 was the best they've seen.
That would be a HELL of a jump in HP. They are starting quite a few HP down compared to the Vic motor to start with.
September issue of Rider magazine has a test of the new Road Glide Ultra with the 103 engine.
Max. Horsepower: 68.1 @ 5000 rpm
Max. Torque: 85.2 @ 3600 rpm
Yeah......only 68HP.....no shit. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 1109
| I think the local dealer is blowing smoke at them. One dealer told a customer he would see 110hp. Like I said 82-85 was the best and I'm not sure they weren't adding a few hp. The best dyno sheet I've seen was 78hp. I know they were disappointed and they spent far more than a Vision owner would.
Edited by kris1956 2012-06-18 5:49 AM
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Tourer
Posts: 395
Moravia, IA | kris1956 - 2012-06-18 5:49 AM
I think the local dealer is blowing smoke at them. One dealer told a customer he would see 110hp. Like I said 82-85 was the best and I'm not sure they weren't adding a few hp. The best dyno sheet I've seen was 78hp. ?I know they were disappointed and they spent far more than a Vision owner would.
Thats about what Im seeing on dyno runs at bike night.....the HD guys spending a boat load of money and thrilled shitless to break 80hp.
There was one dude riding a street glide.....he built his motor specifically to run on ethanol blend - not sure what that entailed.....but thats what he said.
It hit 115hp.....dont remember the tq. I was impressed..... |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 1109
| A HD can be built to hit 115-120hp and I know people that have done it. The money they spent and the cost in reliability was ridiculous. I could have shipped my bike to Lloyd and had him put in a 116 kit with all the goodies for less money including shipping. And more hp. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 1109
| In any case I'm still going to install Lloyds cams. I think the hp gain is worth the money. |
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Tourer
Posts: 323
Troy, NY | Who did the install and Dyno? Did you get the IUV done too? I'm extremely happy with my set up...113hp and 109 torq. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 1117
Northeast Ohio | ^^^ I was wondering the same thing. I had Lloyd, himself, install and dyno my bike. I have the S1L1 exhaust, air filter and reflash. Lloyd added his DR1 cams and a Power Commander 5 with AutoTune. I made 116.88 @ 6000 rpm (see signature) or 105HP at 5000 (stock redline). A stock S1L1 bike typically makes 87HP at the rear wheels (5000 rpm).
Edited by ScoreBo 2012-06-18 9:11 AM
(2011Cams&PCV (Small).jpg)
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 2011Cams&PCV (Small).jpg (76KB - 5 downloads)
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Iron Butt
Posts: 935
Rockford, IL | DrJohn2 - 2012-06-18 12:46 AM I recently had a Lloydz cam, along with a Fuel Commander V, put into my 2009 Vision, expecting the 30% increase in hp that Lloydz advertises. Don't believe 'em. Dyno after showed 99 hp at the rear wheels, which is maybe 15-16% increase at best. Torque went up to 105, but for the money, I'm not a happy camper. What are you comparing to to get the 15-16% increase??
Keep in mind that at the wheel a stock Vision has about 80hp and 95 torque. |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 10
Roseburg, OR | My mechanic pulled up specs sowing stock Vision at 84 HP at rear wheel. 80 at rear wheel ending at 99 Would be almost 25%, which would be better. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 185
Rhode Island | DRJohn2,
I'm no expert but I do know you will need to get the bike breathing to get the most out of it. Do you have high flow filter plus either the Ness or Lloyds top intake filter and performance pipes of some kind?
Jim |
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Cruiser
Posts: 69
AZ | aaronrkelly - 2012-06-18 4:42 AM
September issue of Rider magazine has a test of the new Road Glide Ultra with the 103 engine.
Max. Horsepower: 68.1 @ 5000 rpm
Max. Torque: 85.2 @ 3600 rpm
Yeah......only 68HP.....no shit.
My 09 Vision Stage 2 (Lloyd's cams, 2 upgraded air filters, PCV w/auto tune, level 2 pipes) dyno'ed 100hp/104tq and runs strong. I avg about 41 to 43 mpg.
My 11 RGU 103 Stage 1 (pipes, air filter, PCV) dyno'ed 77hp/92tq and runs strong. I avg about 44 to 46 mpg.
I'm pleased with how they both came out, but due to the gear ratios of the RGU it is "quicker" at partial throttle (0 to 40 percent) and between 2000 to 4000rpm.... that is where I do most of my street riding.
regards,
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Visionary
Posts: 1632
Jasper, MO | DrJohn2 - 2012-06-18 10:52 AM
My mechanic pulled up specs sowing stock Vision at 84 HP at rear wheel. 80 at rear wheel ending at 99 Would be almost 25%, which would be better.
You need more air going in to feed the ponies, which the Lloydz or Ness top filter will give you if you don't have one. The stock exhaust flows plenty good enough if you want to keep it--it will not restrict power at the levels we are talking about. Just adding a fuel controller doesn't complete the job--it has to be tuned to your bike and your setup to get the most out of it. The cams, a fuel controller, and a top intake filter are all you need to get to the 110HP level. Maybe you just need a bit of fine tuning.
If it makes you feel any better, the 6 cylinder 112 cubic inch (1832cc) GL1800 Goldwings typically dyno at 96 HP and 104 TQ with the addition of a Power Commander. Your 2 cylinder 106 cubic inch Vision is already a match for them. A little fine tuning should put you in front of them.
Also, be aware that different dynos will give different readings on the same bike, and even the same dyno will give different readings on different days on the same bike. A dyno is only a tool to show relative changes. You have to compare apples to apples. The dyno operator can make a bike gain or lose apparent horsepower just by how he sets the parameters for the test. What was your baseline on that dyno before you added the cams?
Ronnie
Edited by rdbudd 2012-06-18 6:53 PM
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Tourer
Posts: 499
Chattanooga, TN | Don't know my original dyno numbers before Daytona 2012. But while I was there, Kyle's guys from KMC Powersports did some mods. I had torque tubes, top air filter, aic valve and VFC III installed. It made 92 hp and 109 ft/lbs torque. Then at the SEVR in Helen GA he did the cams and I got 108 hp 115 ft/lbs. I'm happy, but it is still making power at the cutoff, so I'll be getting the PCV 5 sometime early next year to boost the redline. If the original number is 84 hp at the wheel bone stock, that's about a 28.57% increase in hp alone. I'm happy and feel it was money well spent. Good job Kyle, Captain Jack and the other guy! |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 10
Roseburg, OR | I've got the high flow filter but was told the top filter was so noisy I wouldn't be happy with it |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 10
Roseburg, OR | Good info. Like I told someone else, I was persuaded that the top filter was too noisy. The dyno was a tune, but the guy on the Dyno said it was so dialed in there wasn't much he could do and it wasnt worth trashing the motor over. Maybe I should look at the top filter... Either way, what I'm hearing is that 99 HP and 105 torque ain't bad. |
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | Yeah i dont have cams and i have the top filter. its a difference you can feel... allows your engine to breathe quicker. it is a little noisey but nothing crazy. If you were and spent the money to get cams installed, Not having the top filter is kind of like not having the complete package..
filter http://www.lloydz.com/store/item_view.asp?estore_itemid=1000120
on this page you can see a bunch of dynos with and out differnt mods.. http://www.lloydz.com/dyno.asp |
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Tourer
Posts: 395
Moravia, IA | DrJohn......get the top filter, its not that bad. Im all about comfort and I listen to my ipod everytime I ride.
The noise is mostly at idle.....you can barely notice after your moving.......and if the radio is on at all it disappears.
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Visionary
Posts: 2118
Pitt Meadows, BC Canada | Horsepower - Smorshcower.
I been 'KevinXinated' for a couple of years - and I have WHOPPED every Harley that tried to show ME something (including a few of my buddies with $10G in Hop-up-crap on their bikes) - and done it with the Co-Pilot on the bike. REAL WORLD POWER - that's what matters ....
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Cruiser
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Phenix City AL. | I think your dyno guy is not very good with vics, |
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | jb.hatch - 2012-06-19 1:26 AM
I think your dyno guy is not very good with vics,
I was wondering something like that.. cause the customer spends alot of money to get the cams installed and fuel controller then the guy talks the customer out of letting More air into his engine by saying it make noise... i would think that if a customer is going to drop a 4 digit number on performance a little air noise is not going to be a issue... |
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Lloydz cam
