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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | Since I have had the S1L1 installed on my vision I noticed popping and coughing at the intake and the pipes. I recently noticed that while merging on a freeway it will at times act like it wants to stall going into 2nd gear. The bike went back into the dealer today. The dealer called victory to make sure that the s1l1 map took. It did according to victory and the digital wrench. So victory thought they was a intake leak due to the problems I mentioned, so they had my dealer check for a intake gasket leak (don't know where at) then they wanted them to check for a exhaust leak, and then even check something that had to do with the idle and throttle cables. (idle is not adjustable so they said) but they wanted my dealer to raise the idle with something and spray starter fluid at a certain area to see if there was a intake leak. When nothing was found, Victory changed their story and said, its normal and that's how it runs based on the S1L1 map and the EPA regs for that map.. I told them, its one thing to pop and cough, but to almost stall!
Also I noticed that my mpg is close to 50mpg. And now my gatlin end caps never turn black now. Which both of them are good things. Just not normal to what I am used too. All of these issues happened AFTER they installed the replacement air filter and the S1L1 map.
I was nice to my dealer, but I told them. I need this in writing that this is normal. Normal meaning I could stall while merging onto the freeway. They said why? I said I need to know who to sue when I get into a accident.. then they said they want my bike over night and they will call victory again. I said if victory said this is NORMAL and there is NOTHING they can do for me. I want this in writing.. Bottom line the dealer told me they think it is running to lean and shows all the signs of a lean running motorcycle. But since I have a F.I. system I would have to purchase a $300+ device to "FIX" the setup that shouldn't need fixed.. anyone else have this issue? What was your fix..
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Cruiser
Posts: 115
Columbus, Ga | Mine has had S1L1 since the day I picked it up. It now has 900mi on it. It will stumble and sometimes stall if I give it a few short revs while I am stopped like at a red light right before I take off. That kinda safety rev before you take off just to make sure the bike is going to respond before you take off and not flashy rev just to get looked at. It also pops upshifting from time to time. It has stalled twice on me going into 2nd. It feels to me like its loading up. Gatlin tips get dark but I think no darker than normal as I understand thats what they do. I am hoping for some input on this subject as well. I have a 09 for about a month now. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1484
LaPorte,Tx. | There really is an issue with the dealer - service. Sounds a lot like the dealers in my area. I would be interested on how many Visions with your set up they have sold. Find out if others from the dealer have had to install a fuel controller for $$$$$. My advice if you can find a better dealer - service, do it. Good luck. |
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | WOW! i cant believe this is how a OEM setup would run from victory! i can see if this was some aftermarket product! but this is a Victory setup... and it runs like crap compared to stock.. when my bike was stock it never ever stalled or popped or coughed... no noises at all... i asked the dealer to make a request for victory to purchase my s1l1 setup back from me.. i dont think a $500 setup should run like this... to be honest the backfiring,popping is embarrassing... but more so the stalling it straight out telling me something is NOT right with the bike! |
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Visionary
Posts: 1484
LaPorte,Tx. | The Stage 1 level 1 is a dealer installed option. There are hundreds of Stage 1 Level 1 and 2 running around out there with no problems, so why do you blame Victory for your issues. How do you know the install was correct and the dealer is just wanting you to buy a fuel controller. When I ordered my Vision, I ordered the Stage 1 Level 1 kit. When I got the bike, I installed the air filter and the mufflers and ran it that way for several hunderd miles until I was able to get the bike to the dealer for the flash. Bike ran lean, popped and stalled gas mileage was high. But I figured it was due to not being flashed with the new code for the set up. After that was done, things were better. |
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | I'm starting to get the feeling there are falty EFI's out there and yet to be discovered. I'm stock 100% and I've had popping issues again here recently. My dealer has tried to convince me that stock has issues that S1L1 will take care of. I've told them that doesn't matter to me because the bike should run fantastic from stock. My popping is not as severe as some has described though when I first got it, it was. It seemed to be an exhaust leak that caused the problem and feel that is the issue still, or an intake leak. I'm hoping to get time soon to shake it down to see what is the issue, but hopefully some will hit the real problem here and we can get on with riding. |
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | my dealer mentioned about a fuel controller, but said they arent aware of one for my bike. so it didnt sound like they were making a sale.. they werent saying hey if you buy "XXX" your problems will be gone.. but they did say it is running lean, no matter what victory tells them.. my dealer said the victory maps have to pass the EPA regs. i could careless about the epa regs but its not up to me.. kinda makes me wonder though... If i was to get a fuel controller like the VFCIII i would surely get that intake to at least try and make buying a fuel controller more worth while... |
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Tourer
Posts: 354
20 miles west of Chicago. | I think Vision Tex hit the nail. Your dealer doesn't sound too knowlegable about his product, and you may want to make sure the Stage 1 reflash was properly done. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 215
Boydsville, AR United States | Mine also has these issues. I havent even run a tank of gas through it yet, but with these issues, I think a tripback to the dealer is in order. Mine pops when you roo on the throttle from a idle, and sometimes between shifts. It has a LOT MORE power though. My question is, why would leaky gaskets just show up. If that were the case, why didn't the problem show up with the old set up? I bought Victory upgrades, instead of aftermarket because I thought Victory had tested the setup. I would expect a $300.00 toll to fix it if you had bought aftermarket, BUT????
I agree with the lean running. There is amoung snowmobilers who like to ride the lean edge of the curve on jetting. If if runs like it has never before (fast), its probally gonna burn down. A lean running 4 stroke probally woun't burn down, but will generate more heat at the pipes, and they are hot enough all ready |
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | yesterday my dealer confirmed over the phone with victory that the S1L1 map is installed in my bike. whats interesting to me is. how the victory tech over the phone said, OH YEAH there is something wrong no doubt. but then after he told me dealer what to do and nothing came back with a fix, the same tech said its now Normal.. so like i said before ok. i want a receipt or something in writting saying this is normal so when i get into a accident i know who to Sue.... bottom line of facts.
1) bike ran great before s1l1
2) bike even ran good with before the air filter was installed and NEW fuel injection map installed.
victory had them check for exhaust leaks and some sort of intake leak. VIC wanted them to check for a intake leak because this happened on 5 other visions with this problem. (according to vic over the phone) Ill tell you this. they sure had alot of ideas and opinions on what was WRONG, until they couldnt find what was wrong, then it was labeled normal. so today i will call the dealer and see what they said.. no better yet i will just leave it there and wait for them to call me since i go back to work tomorrow anyways.. i refuse to buy a fuel controller to fix their lame ass EPA s1l1 map. and from what ive been reading on 3 forums i am not alone on this.... |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 37
Kewaskum, WI | Chris - You are not alone. I am having a similar issue. |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 37
Kewaskum, WI | VisionTex - 2009-05-04 8:15 PM
The Stage 1 level 1 is a dealer installed option. There are hundreds of Stage 1 Level 1 and 2 running around out there with no problems, so why do you blame Victory for your issues.
Well, there is a problem with the S1 map from Victory. Just ask the hundreds of riders who get the popping on decel. I know of ONE Vision that has the S1 setup and doesn't pop on decel (and he is running an illegal map obtained from a Victory engineer). If yours doesn't pop, then I guess there are two Visions  . Now, whether or not the map is the issue in THIS case, that remains to be seen. But the fact of the matter is, there are problems with the map, Victory knows there are problems with the map.
Edited by raynman 2009-05-05 11:15 AM
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | my dealer told me today he was going to ride the bike cold and then report to victory how it rides. but im guessing i am S.O.L. As he can only do what victory allows them to do.. i told them i was unhappy with this S1L1 performance in terms of just normal riding. popping,surging almost stalling.. im not concerned with MAX HP. i just wanted it to sound good, but then after the s1l1 map was installed is when it started acting up... its kinda embarrassing how much it pops between shifts. it makes the bike look like there is something wrong with it. but my main concern is safety.. im nervous about it stalling on a highway with a car behind me.. maybe its not a real concern? but it was scary riding to my dealer yesterday when it was surging like it wasnt getting spark.. then when it warmed up a little more it wasnt as bad.. but if you pull from a dead stop thats when you really feel it.. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 257
Under the Rule of Jedi - Masshole | For what it's worth, I did a self install of the S1L1 pipes, didn't install the air cleaner that came with it, didn't have the re-mapping done, matter of fact it has never gone back to the dealer other than to buy more stuff, and with over 5500 miles, it runs just great. I don't need all the power, I have other bikes if I feel a need for speed. So my advice, either look for another dealer, try looking for an exhaust leak yourself, or ask the dealer to put it back stock at his cost since it ran better that way. I wish I had a better answer for you, but it seems like something just isn't right.
Edited by Member No. 1 2009-05-05 1:28 PM
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | yeah i was thinking about that.. putting back to stock.. it ran fine on just the mufflers for the 1-2 days before the air filter and flashing.. but like i said as soon as they installed the air filter and flashed the ecu to have s1l1 mapping it when it was night and day difference.... i know the air filter is too let in MORE air, but i thought the map was to let more fuel in to match the increased air flow? its almost like i installed the air filter with no s1l1 flash at all. on the digtial wrench from victory it shows i have the S1L1 map installed. So i dont know whats next. i mentioned to my deal. ( i wasnt serious) but i mentioned since victory thinking this popping and surging is normal, would they buy back my $500 setup io bought that doesnt let my bike function properly. the dealer said thats up to them. i wasnt totally serious about that. but i am serious about the bike sounding like and running like an improperly jetting carb.. the dealer even said it running like a bike that needed rejetted. but there is nothing they can do about that expect install the maps that victory gives them... and victory said they have to have maps that are to the EPA specs... UPDATE i just got a call from my dealer.. they rode the bike and it didnt "sneeze" for them when they rode it.. victory told them over the phone there is nothing they can do for me.. it is what it is.. and they have had other calls related to the same issue.. but the map is what it is a epa reg'd fuel map.. none adjustable. i wonder now much thought went into these maps. and i think it was kevinX that told me about the issues related to the victory fuel maps or the closed looped F.I. i told him back then i never had a problem with mine at all.. UNTIL NOW........ now i see exactly what he means..... i have a feeling this is going to cost me... "fuel controller".. which is damn near $300 ! well time to go pick up my bike and try not to rip someone a new one.. its not my dealers fault. i cant blame them since soo many others on other forums are complaining about the same thing! |
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Cruiser
Posts: 257
Under the Rule of Jedi - Masshole | I feel your pain. I wouldn't want to be in your shoes. Can/will the dealer put the stock map back without changing the pipes? Stock air filter maybe? I mean just for sheets and giggles.
I see you are in SW PA, maybe a ride up to Pine Bush NY is in order. I hear there is a man that has a screw driver and paper clip! Ah yes the old days of tuning a Victory! Remember boys? |
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | When my bike was at its worse with the popping, just within a month of getting, my dealer kept it for a few days and swore they never could get it to do it. This was actually on more than one occasion. I would leave the dealer and not even get around the corner and it would do it again. All I kept hearing in my ear was "Get S1L1" and that should take care of it. I personnally rank my dealer up there among the best, but don't understand these types of exchanges. It still pops, a little, but I'll never take it back to them for that reason. I know this is a simple fix somewhere, it is just yet to be discovered. Tightening the exhaust nuts alone took care of 90% of it, but it does still does the "sneeze". |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 37
Kewaskum, WI | I don't think the real issue here is the popping, that's just an annoyance that you may have to live with. The real issue here is the hesitation/stalling that is occuring in second gear. This is a safety issue that really needs to be addressed. |
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | we may be talking related issues but not the same issue. Once I am under way I do not have a problem, it is when I take off, if I get there then it is not problem. The other time it occurs is coming to a stop and I let off the gas and disengage the clutch, it might die sometimes. This occurs especially in traffic, and yes it is a hazard. I'm glad it fires quickly after it shuts off. It doesn't happen everytime, but once is too much. either way, it is not cool just because the bike is. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 1117
Northeast Ohio | Do you remember the reflash recall from last year? Confirm with your dealer that you are indeed getting the latest S1L1 reflash from Vic that 'helps' with the stalling issue from 2008. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1484
LaPorte,Tx. | raynman - 2009-05-05 10:07 AM
VisionTex - 2009-05-04 8:15 PM
The Stage 1 level 1 is a dealer installed option. There are hundreds of Stage 1 Level 1 and 2 running around out there with no problems, so why do you blame Victory for your issues.
Well, there is a problem with the S1 map from Victory. Just ask the hundreds of riders who get the popping on decel. I know of ONE Vision that has the S1 setup and doesn't pop on decel (and he is running an illegal map obtained from a Victory engineer). If yours doesn't pop, then I guess there are two Visions . Now, whether or not the map is the issue in THIS case, that remains to be seen. But the fact of the matter is, there are problems with the map, Victory knows there are problems with the map.
Yes, I don't have the problem because I use Synthetic oil. It is SLICKERY and doesn't let that pressure build up and fart out during decel. |
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | well i rode home from the dealer and it is still doing it.. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 257
Under the Rule of Jedi - Masshole | raynman - 2009-05-05 12:07 PM
VisionTex - 2009-05-04 8:15 PM
The Stage 1 level 1 is a dealer installed option. There are hundreds of Stage 1 Level 1 and 2 running around out there with no problems, so why do you blame Victory for your issues.
Well, there is a problem with the S1 map from Victory. Just ask the hundreds of riders who get the popping on decel. I know of ONE Vision that has the S1 setup and doesn't pop on decel (and he is running an illegal map obtained from a Victory engineer). If yours doesn't pop, then I guess there are two Visions . Now, whether or not the map is the issue in THIS case, that remains to be seen. But the fact of the matter is, there are problems with the map, Victory knows there are problems with the map.
Make that 3 that doesn't pop because mine with the S1L1 stock air filter and stock map doesn't. |
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | with your stock air filter i think your NOT letting in more air.. more air is the reason i "think" it is running lean... but here is my 2cents.. i didnt spend all that money to NOT use every part of the package i paid for.. that air filter is $60 alone! not even counting the map you paid for as part of the package.. So unless your using all parts of the package you really cant say the s1l1 is not popping |
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | Well, the big long Victory truck is at my dealer. So on the way home I stop by to chat since I won't get there tomorrow maybe before he leaves. I tell the driver that I've got over 40K and wanted to know if he knew how many had more. He says he knows of one guy in florida, somewhere around melbourne that has over 60K. Then he asks "are you having any problems?" I say "none, except for the poppin'" My dealer chimes in and says "yeah, and he's still running the stock pipes and has all the latest reflash." Now I don't say anything about this discussion or the zillion other posts on the boards concerning this, but the trailer guy says "I think it is those O2 sensors that is giving the problem because of all the others that have the problem." Well from that point on we went to another subject. Has any one had their O2 sensors changed and it made a difference??? |
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S1L1 issue after install.
