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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| http://www.hdforums.com/industry-news/rumor-2012-harleys-to-be-liqu... |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 29
Lexington Park MD | That rumor creeps up every year around the time the new models are released. The earliest reference to this rumor I found in a quick google search was 2001 but it's probably been around longer than that. http://www.motorcycle.com/forum/harley-davidson-news/244-water-cool...
Last year someone added a Road Glide fairing and some bags to the VRod and posted it on YouTube as an exclusive find. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vXDPfdYrg0
When dealing with internet rumors don't believe half of what you read and doubt the rest.
Edited by Goatlocker95 2011-06-07 9:46 PM
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Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | Think about it, Harley would do this just to get the increased horsepower to compete with Victory. They've already got the ground work with the V-Rod so a little more work they can keep the potato-potato sound, increase horsepower and reliability all in one swoop. Now the problem with that is Victory would have to increase the bag size on the Vision to compete with Harley's increased horsepower. So then the Vision would be this big bubble butt looking bike just because of Harley's liquid cooled engine with increased horsepower and that would drive the sales down on the Vision because of the loss of sex-appeal. But then again, fat-bottomed bikes makes the ridin' world go 'round... I'm just saying... |
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Fountain Inn, SC United States | Cap'n - it scares me that I knew where you were going with that post before I finished reading it. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 880
Orlando, FL | Cap'n....ya lost me on that one. Why would they have to increase the bag size on the Vision? Personally I think the rumor is ultimately related to emissions and requirements from the gov. It won't be long and all the V twins will be water cooled. Honda, Kawi, Suzuki have all had water cooled V twins for years, and they sound as good or better (as in the case of MY Kawi! LOL) than HD's They are cooler to ride in warm climate (I live in FL). They look the same (except for a radiator placed somehwere), sound the same, run cooler (hence increasing life) and can meet emission standards easier. So it'll happen someday. BUt I don't see how that has an impact on the Vision's bags! As Ricky Ricardo would say......"Lucy, you got some splaining to do!" |
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| The V rod motor doesn't have the torque or the power to push a 800 pound bike. It does seam there going to put a radiator on the bikes for oil to bring down the emissions. There radiator has to be bigger then what they have now. I think if they went to water they could close there doors. |
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Visionary
Posts: 2300
Georgia, west of Atlanta | IF and this is a big IF Harley chose to suplement some models ( i.e. RoadGlide ) with a 1/2" stroked V-rod engine, it would be 95 cu in and have good torque characteristics and make plenty of HP. If they EVER do it I would eventually add one to my collection.............I'm keeping the Vision though, in fact my plan is to never get rid of a motorcycle again.....................I'll need a bigger garage  |
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Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | MaddMAx2u - 2011-06-08 10:45 AM
Cap'n....ya lost me on that one. Why would they have to increase the bag size on the Vision? Personally I think the rumor is ultimately related to emissions and requirements from the gov. It won't be long and all the V twins will be water cooled. Honda, Kawi, Suzuki have all had water cooled V twins for years, and they sound as good or better (as in the case of MY Kawi! LOL) than HD's They are cooler to ride in warm climate (I live in FL). They look the same (except for a radiator placed somehwere), sound the same, run cooler (hence increasing life) and can meet emission standards easier. So it'll happen someday. BUt I don't see how that has an impact on the Vision's bags! As Ricky Ricardo would say......"Lucy, you got some splaining to do!"
Okay I'll 'splain it.
Harley has big bags and no HP (without serious mods)
Vision has great HP (without serious mods) and little bags.
Watercooled Harley, more HP with big bags means the Vision has to step up notch in the bag department to level the competition.
..ey, yeye, yeye... |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 880
Orlando, FL | Well, shiver me timbers Cap'n |
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Visionary
Posts: 2118
Pitt Meadows, BC Canada | What SOLD me on the Vision was the fact that it is a MOTOR cycle. Not some scupture HIDING an engine of some sort underneath layers of fibreglass. The Victory engine stands out as part of the design - and it is beautifully done. No oil and water and electric pipes running all over the cylinders. In my opinion - the nicest looking engine on ANY motorcycle I have seen in my life. And the damned thing WORKS ! And works well, for a big machine - especially if it is KevinXinated.
Are V-Rods, or other watercooled V's more efficient? YES. Uglier? YES INDEED. Feel Good? YUCK.
I have never owned a 'short-term' bike - typically keeping good ones for many years. At my age - that means the '08 VV is my LAST bike. And it will easily outrun most of the youngster's on their pricey HD's, and even many of the youngster's on their crotch rockets. And there is ALWAYS something faster - doesn't mean I have to go out and get one. I'm staying with the best looking MOTORcycle ever designed and built !!! |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 965
New York State | I think the Vision would be better with a radiator. I rode a Triumph T-Bird Storm the other day it is water cooled and fast . I live in a congested area if I get stuck in traffic my bikes cook
Edited by Trekwolf164 2011-06-08 1:25 PM
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Visionary
Posts: 2118
Pitt Meadows, BC Canada | Trekwolf164 - 2011-06-08 11:24 AM I think the Vision would be better with a radiator. I rode a Triumph T-Bird Storm the other day it is water cooled and fast . I live in a congested area if I get stuck in traffic my bikes cook NOT that simple. What about the water-jackets on the engine? UGLY. How about the water-pipes to the radiator? UGLY. Higher maintainance? YEAH. Cooler? YEAH. Might as well buy a BMW.... |
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Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | though it can be argued, watercooled MC engines are a pain. I actually hated to smell antifreeze on my Gold Wing and it was a whole new level of maintenance. Air-cooled V-Twins are virtually maintenance free for Victory and I'd probably give up riding all together if all I could get is a water-cooled bike from this point forward. If that's your thing, have all the fun your heart can take. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 880
Orlando, FL | Not that it really matters as this is pure conjucture (sp?), but I bet those who argue against water cooled V twins have never owned one or really looked at one. I have had My Kawi Water cooled V twin for almost 7 years. The engine actually looks better than my Vision's. It sounds better than most bikes HD or other. It runs cooler, has torque and HP up the ying yang, and has never failed me. Other than the HIDDEN radiator you would be hard pressed to tell it's water cooled. Smell antifreeze? Come on. Really? Can't speak for a Gold Wing, but we atre talking V twins here. I'd post a pic but all my pics are apparently too big. What's with the 100 kb restriction on size? I'm not a computer geek! |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 1109
| Can't say I ever smelled anti-freeze on my wing and I rode it over 100k miles. |
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Visionary
Posts: 2118
Pitt Meadows, BC Canada | MaddMAx2u - 2011-06-08 12:54 PM Not that it really matters as this is pure conjucture (sp?), but I bet those who argue against water cooled V twins have never owned one or really looked at one. I have had My Kawi Water cooled V twin for almost 7 years. The engine actually looks better than my Vision's. It sounds better than most bikes HD or other. It runs cooler, has torque and HP up the ying yang, and has never failed me. Other than the HIDDEN radiator you would be hard pressed to tell it's water cooled. Smell antifreeze? Come on. Really? Can't speak for a Gold Wing, but we atre talking V twins here. I'd post a pic but all my pics are apparently too big. What's with the 100 kb restriction on size? I'm not a computer geek! UGLY - FUGLY even. Re: size of image - easy fix for all Windows users: 1. Browse to the picture you want to resize - then RIGHT CLICK on image (you can select a bunch of pictures if you use CTRL/CLICK) 2. You will see a pop up with a bunch of choices - select "Send To" - then "Mail Recipient" 3. You will be asked what size to make the sent photos - Select "Smaller 640 X 480" 4. This will create an E-Mail with the pictures ready to send to ...... but you just want to save the re-sized (smaller) pictures. 5. Right click on the image(s) in the e-mail - and choose "Save as ..." 6. Browse to a place where you want the image(s) to be saved (I usually create directories called "Blah Blah E-Mail Images" 7. RIGHT CLICK in the directory you have chosen and click "Paste" - the resized photos will then be saved for other uses - such as including on this website. This is really easier than it sounds - play around a bit and you will see how easy it is. BOO WATERCOOLING .... |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 965
New York State | donetracey - 2011-06-08 2:13 PM
Trekwolf164 - 2011-06-08 11:24 AM I think the Vision would be better with a radiator. I rode a Triumph T-Bird Storm the other day it is water cooled and fast . I live in a congested area if I get stuck in traffic my bikes cook NOT that simple. What about the water-jackets on the engine? UGLY. How about the water-pipes to the radiator? UGLY. Higher maintainance? YEAH. Cooler? YEAH. Might as well buy a BMW.... ?
http://youtu.be/aFO0eZpNLVU
This bike is water cooled I see no plumbing .
The Visions forward fairing would hide a radiator no problem
Edited by Trekwolf164 2011-06-08 3:37 PM
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Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | MaddMAx2u - 2011-06-08 2:54 PM
Not that it really matters as this is pure conjucture (sp?), but I bet those who argue against water cooled V twins have never owned one or really looked at one. I have had My Kawi Water cooled V twin for almost 7 years. The engine actually looks better than my Vision's. It sounds better than most bikes HD or other. It runs cooler, has torque and HP up the ying yang, and has never failed me. Other than the HIDDEN radiator you would be hard pressed to tell it's water cooled. Smell antifreeze? Come on. Really? Can't speak for a Gold Wing, but we atre talking V twins here. I'd post a pic but all my pics are apparently too big. What's with the 100 kb restriction on size? I'm not a computer geek!
...and I said, though it can be argued.....
I'm not trying to convince you on your feelings of a watercooled engine, I'm just stating my thoughts on it. I don't need to ride a 100,000 miles on a watercooled engine to say I like it or don't like it. I've seen puddles, and I have smelled anti-freeze around watercooled engines. Also, as I understand it, you must use antifreeze without silicate, a common automotive antifreeze ingredient, so if you are on the road and you need antifreeze you best have some with you or find a honda dealer that is open.
But there again, just my opinion, and mine alone, you enjoy your ride no matter how I feel about it, please. |
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Visionary
Posts: 2118
Pitt Meadows, BC Canada | Re: Triumph
Looks like a 1958 Chevy. Dual headlights and all. Some sort of black blob that sits where a MOTOR should be ....
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Iron Butt
Posts: 965
New York State | donetracey - 2011-06-08 3:53 PM
Re: Triumph
Looks like a 1958 Chevy. Dual headlights and all. Some sort of black blob that sits where a MOTOR should be ....
Yes a classic powerhouse defined by its utility and power over its exterior look.
Good call |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 880
Orlando, FL | donetracey, thanks for the info on how to re-size my photo. It's still a pain in the arse and now the resolution sucks! But here's my Kawi. So tell me you really think the engine is FUGLY-UGLY. I always get stopped and asked 2 things after getting compliments on this bike. Q1. Who makes it? Q2. Who makes the pipes? The only bike I have ever gotten more compliments on is my Vision. And it's not becasue of the Vision's engine that I get those compliments!
Edited by MaddMAx2u 2011-06-08 4:16 PM
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Iron Butt
Posts: 880
Orlando, FL | And that was so much fun here's the flip side!
And just the engine for you to enjoy! LOL
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Visionary
Posts: 2118
Pitt Meadows, BC Canada | Nice looking machine! But simply not nearly as nice as this:
(120ci Visionsm.jpg)
Attachments
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 120ci Visionsm.jpg (79KB - 3 downloads)
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Iron Butt
Posts: 1109
| What did you do to get 120? |
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Visionary
Posts: 2300
Georgia, west of Atlanta | I thought 116" was the biggest you could take the bore out to. Is someone making a stroker crank?? Maybe Falicon ?? |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 880
Orlando, FL | He put a sign on it and ....... taaa-daaaaaaa. 120" |
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Visionary
Posts: 2300
Georgia, west of Atlanta | If we could get someone to make a 118mm stroker crank we'd have 125 cu inches with a Lloyds big bore kit. it would be a monster !!!!!! |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 880
Orlando, FL | OK Steve, you do that, I'm going to link 2 of 'em side by side, both stock and have a measly 212" Now about that heat issue from that other thread???????? |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 9
| I think it's good for the industry that the "American Legend" has to play catch-up with an American brand with 13 years under its belt. The consumer benefits in the end. |
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Tourer
Posts: 444
Bay of Gigs, WA | Water cooled hogs...hmmm...guess they could call them "Obama-Davidson" then. We gotta root out this evil, people!!! |
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Visionary
Posts: 2300
Georgia, west of Atlanta | MaddMax count me in on that one................ |
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Tourer
Posts: 523
seattle, wa | Maybe why HD is going to cool down?
"Harley has always been on the cutting edge of technology" HA HA
http://sacramento.cbslocal.com/2011/06/23/call-kurtis-harley-davids... |
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Tourer
Posts: 457
Green Bay, WI United States | HARLEY HAS BEEN WORKING ON ADDING WATER TO THE HEADS FOR THE LAST 5 YEARS THAT I KNOW OF. IT WAS ONLY THE HEADS THAT WERE BEING LOOKED INTO, NOT THE WHOLE MOTOR. TUBES WERE GOING TO BE CAST INTO THE HEADS BUT THIS CREATED A DIE CASTING NIGHTMARE. THE MANUFACTURE OF H-D HEADS HAS SINCE BEEN CHANGED AND LAST I KNEW THIS MODIFICATION WAS DEAD IN THE WATER. AS FOR A WHOLE "WATER COOLED" ENGINE OTHER THAN THE "ROD", THIS IS NEWS TO ME. BUY A VICTORY - ANY MODEL AND YOU WILL BE THE ROAD CAPTAIN ....
RIDE HARD, RIDE FAST, BUT ABOVE ALL RIDE SAFE AND FREE...
WILDMAN/8-BALL
rIDE |
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Cruiser
Posts: 277
Apopka, FL | Oops... wrong post.
Edited by DrDecay 2011-06-28 10:23 PM
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Cruiser
Posts: 277
Apopka, FL | XRsteve - 2011-06-08 9:00 PM
I thought 116" was the biggest you could take the bore out to. Is someone making a stroker crank?? Maybe Falicon ??
Or someone made a nice sticker!
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Cruiser
Posts: 216
Danville, CA | Interesting for sure. Maybe they are looking at big engines overall and need to cool them off. |
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Tourer
Posts: 353
| 8-ball - 2011-06-28 5:43 PM
HARLEY HAS BEEN WORKING ON ADDING WATER TO THE HEADS FOR THE LAST 5 YEARS THAT I KNOW OF. IT WAS ONLY THE HEADS THAT WERE BEING LOOKED INTO, NOT THE WHOLE MOTOR. TUBES WERE GOING TO BE CAST INTO THE HEADS BUT THIS CREATED A DIE CASTING NIGHTMARE. THE MANUFACTURE OF H-D HEADS HAS SINCE BEEN CHANGED AND LAST I KNEW THIS MODIFICATION WAS DEAD IN THE WATER. AS FOR A WHOLE "WATER COOLED" ENGINE OTHER THAN THE "ROD", THIS IS NEWS TO ME. BUY A VICTORY - ANY MODEL AND YOU WILL BE THE ROAD CAPTAIN ....
RIDE HARD, RIDE FAST, BUT ABOVE ALL RIDE SAFE AND FREE...
WILDMAN/8-BALL
rIDE
How much less efficient is the Vic liquid and air cooled engine than a water cooled one anyway? Both are pumping fluid through a "radiator" and the Vic actually pumps it's cooling fluid through the entire engine. They could always bump the cooling up a notch by adding a small fan for the oil cooler. |
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