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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 49
Fort Defiance, VA United States | As many of you know from my earlier first post this week, I was considering a Vision. Thanks to many of you, I have decided to buy one. Now the question is this. I had planned on buying a new one, but have found an almost new 2010. I know the 2011 has an all new transmission and the service interval has increased from 2500 miles to 5000 miles. Is it worth the extra dollars to buy new with the transmission improvements? Changing the oil every 2500 miles seems crazy to me. I'll be taking an 8000 mile trip in June and don't want to have to think about changing the oil 3 times on the trip. Why did they redesign the tranny so early in this model? |
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Visionary
Posts: 3204
Memphis | The main reason I've heard for the change is the neutral finder detent. The 2011 is also quieter which allows the stock exhaust to be a little louder and still be legal. I've run 5,000 mile oil changes on my '08 ever since the initial 500 mile break in and it is perfectly fine at 50,000 now. As the tranny breaks in (20,000 miles) everything quiets down and neutral gets easier to deal with (although it never was a big issue with me). As the oil breaks down you will notice neutral harder to find on a hot day. Other than that, all of the tranny's are bullet-proof. p.s. - I talked to my mechanic about the 5,000 mile oil change on my '08 and he said that Victory basically wanted the "average" rider to change his oil twice a year so they came up with that 2,500 mile interval. I was racking up 2,500 every other month so I doubled the interval. No warranty issues since my dealer performed/documented all the oil changes with Victory oil.
Edited by SongFan 2011-02-26 7:06 AM
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Cruiser
Posts: 228
| SongFan - 2011-02-26 6:59 AM
The main reason I've heard?for the change is the?neutral finder detent.? The 2011 is also quieter which allows the stock exhaust to be a little louder and still be legal.? I've run 5,000 mile oil changes on my '08 ever since the initial 500 mile break in and it is perfectly fine at 50,000 now.? As the tranny breaks in (20,000 miles) everything quiets down and neutral gets easier to deal with (although?it never was a big issue with me).? As the oil breaks down you will notice neutral harder to find on a hot day.? Other than that, all of the tranny's are bullet-proof. p.s. - I talked to my mechanic about the 5,000 mile oil change on my '08 and he said that Victory basically wanted the "average" rider to change his oil twice a year so they came up with that 2,500 mile?interval.? I was racking up 2,500 every other month so I doubled the interval.? No warranty issues since my dealer performed/documented all the oil changes with Victory oil.
+1 on the 5K oil changes which I have also done since the 500 miles change on my "08. The tranny does get a lot better after 20K miles of break-in. I always use a premium quality synthetic oil and premium filter. (not going to mention any brands so as to not start another oil thread) |
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Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | I love these discussions when something is "new and improved". It begs the question, "what was wrong with the old set-up?" The answer is simply this "nothing!". Marketing is exactly that, marketing appeal to get more sales. Victory had an issue with transmissions at one time and address the issue and fix them. I would venture to say Victory probably has the most reliable transmission of any motorcycle and has been for a number of years. The touring weinies, myself included, get a little prissy about noise issues and finding neutral. As much as we love our beloved bikes, it is still machinery none the less, so it will have quirks that some us find less desirable when compared to something else. I don't ride my Vision wishing it did this better, or didn't do that, my mind is clear on the road ahead, lost in the moment but attentive to my surroundings. I'm sure there are plenty of folks disappointed with the 2011 improvements because they weren't good enough. I say, go find something better then.
Sorry for the rant and I hope you make a decision so you can get to riding, this kind of stuff will keep you from making a decision at all. I rolled off the showroom floor in November '07 and haven't looked back except to change lanes. I've rode mine more than once over 6,000 miles on oil and the worst it does is the engine rattles a little when it gets into the end of life on the oil stage. But at 88,000 (100 miles shy today) I do not use or burn oil, tranny shifts fine and I'm still on the original clutch, with both highway and heavy local city driving.
Off my soapbox and gone to go riding....
Edited by Cap'n Nemo 2011-02-26 8:51 AM
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| If your scared about running your oil to 5000 miles had napa do analyze it. They can tell you if your going to far between changes.
Up till 2011 Vic had thick gears now there back cut and thinner. Vic all so made a thicker motor case to hide the noise.
If you don't buy a new one you'll love the 2010 just as much |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 802
| I had a '10 and now have a '11. The '11 is in my opinion quite a bit quieter than the '10 was. The noise the '10 made particularly on acceleration was the only thing I didn't like about the bike. I also found that trying to run the oil over 4000 miles or so on the '10 made it even noisier and harder to shift. The '11 is not only completely without transmission or primary gear noise but running the oil to 5000 miles makes no perceptible difference in the sound or operation of the trans. On the negative side, the '11 is notchier to shift and occasionally balks downshifting from 4th to 3rd and from 3rd to 2nd. The '10 with fresh oil shifted smoother. Mine was one of the first '11s so maybe more recent production shifts better. I run 10-40 synthetic.
Marc |
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Cruiser
Posts: 188
Tifton, GA | I bought the 11 because of the transmission being quieter and ABS on the Pearl White bikes. This was from riding demo 10 model that were not broke in. |
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Tourer
Posts: 492
Indianapolis, IN | There were a number of minor items that needed corrected from 08-09. As I understand it most were corrected for the model year 10's. The tranny noise issue and neutral detent were the final improvements made for the 11's. I bought a 10 with abs about a year ago and have enjoyed 18k trouble free miles since.
I think it just boils down to feeling comfortable with the deal you can work out and what you are willing to pay. Others have already answered the question about extending the oil change interval.
By the way, if color choice is important to you and the '10 you are considering is of the Ocean Blue/Sandstone variety, that color seems somewhat rare and of course is no longer offered. That's what mine is and in my opinion it always stands out, even in a group of visions! Just one more thing to consider. Otherwise you can't go wrong whichever model year you choose. |
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Fountain Inn, SC United States | One change for '11 I didn't like was the gear indicator. It no longer tells you which gear you are in if you are stopped or have the clutch lever pulled in. If I had to decide, I'd go with a '10. Victory also cut a few corners with the '11. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1229
Rancho Cucamonga, CA | I have a 2010 and barely notice any tranny noise. Went to Fuel It this week just to ride a 2011 tranny. The notch at nuetral was nice. I didn't notice it being quieter, but the loss of gear indicator with the clutch in was driving me nuts. I don't always pay attention to how many gears I go thru when coming to a stop, and my eyes are usually scanning traffic instead of my gear gauge. I ended up starting off in 2nd twice in 60 miles. I'm glad they have the torque.
The only big plus I could see was the 5k oil changes. I think the old ones only had the 2.5k rule to get people to change oil 2x a year as well. Once I stop getting free oil changes, I will be extending my maintenance schedule as well.
As much as I HATE to say it, I learned a lot from the oil threads.
p. s. - my 48+/10 ride will be 8321 miles, I plan on 1 oil change during and 1 as soon as I finish. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 77
| So what changes were made in 2010 to the Vision engine/transmission that the 2008's & 2009's don't have? Is it possible to run 5k between oil changes on the 08's & 09's?
Edited by tymwrp 2011-02-26 9:19 PM
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 49
Fort Defiance, VA United States | Jedi Jeff - 2011-02-26 7:58 PM One change for '11 I didn't like was the gear indicator. It no longer tells you which gear you are in if you are stopped or have the clutch lever pulled in. If I had to decide, I'd go with a '10. Victory also cut a few corners with the '11. If the deal falls through, as it appears it will for the used 10, there are still a number of new 10s available. Are you saying you would prefer a new 10 over a new 11? |
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Visionary
Posts: 1632
Jasper, MO | tymwrp - 2011-02-26 9:18 PM
Is it possible to run 5k between oil changes on the 08's & 09's?
I have been doing that since the year 2000 on my 2000 Sport Cruiser. It still has the original transmission and shifts just fine. I also do that with my 2008 Vision. You will need to use another oil than the Victory branded oil though. I would not extend the oil changes if you're using the factory oil. In my experience, the factory oil needs to be changed at the recommended intervals. Shifting starts getting a little "notchy" if you don't. Use a premium synthetic oil and a premium filter. The Wix 51356/NAPA GOLD 1356 can be found at any parts store for $5 or $6, sometimes for less. Do NOT use any oil that is advertised as "Energy Saving" ( it'll have additives like Teflon in it) or you'll possibly cause clutch problems. Do NOT put any "miracle additives" in it. Just stick with a premium multi-grade (xxW/40 weight) oil that has the JASO MA (for wet clutches) rating.
Ronnie |
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Tourer
Posts: 494
Akron Ohio area | As far as knowing what gear I'm in on my 2011 Vision Tour, it's pretty obvious when downshifting from second (through neutral) to first gear.
From Victory's site;
2. PROVEN OUTSTANDING RELIABILITY = LESS MAINTENANCE
Victory has a track record of consistently outstanding reliability and dependability, which has led to the industry?s highest customer satisfaction ratings. This proven reliability, along with the new transmission design, allows Victory to recommend extended oil service intervals for 2011 drivetrains.
? The recommended oil change interval for 2011 models is every 5,000 miles.
? Less-frequent oil changes results in a lower cost of ownership.
We asked Victory engineer James Holroyd to comment on some of the changes in 2011. Regarding reliability, James says ?This important improvement was made possible by the new transmission and its neutral-finder. Previous oil change intervals were dictated by oil breakdown making neutral harder to find at higher mileages. The neutral finder eliminates this problem, and allows you to get the full use out of your oil.?
3. NEW TRANSMISSION
The Victory drivetrain team scrutinized every component of the engine and transmission and fine-tuned the designs and performance of numerous parts. Approximately 40% of the drivetrain is new for 2011, with the transmission receiving so many improvements it is virtually a new transmission.
The changes: improve manufacturing efficiency and quality assurance; enhance the drive train?s already-impressive reliability; improve engine performance; and, for riders, improve ride-ability and deliver a more appealing-sounding transmission.
? In terms of operating sound, selected modulation frequencies have been eliminated. This produces a more-appealing sound ? consistently in each gear. In 4th and 6th gears in particular, gear whine has been reduced. Additionally, whine from the primary gears has been practically eliminated, improving the sound quality of the bike at idle and at lower speeds.
? Driveline lash has been reduced by 66%. This smoothes out on-off throttle transitions and makes for a more pleasant ride, particularly at lower speeds.
? ?Neutral Assist? has been added to make it easier for a rider to shift into neutral when stopped. This will reduce the rider?s effort, will reduce clutch wear and will lessen the performance demands on the oil.
James adds "You won't believe how well it works. The quieter transmission has also allowed us to increase the exhaust's noise level, making stock bikes sound better yet still pass the federally mandated sound limit. Stock never sounded so good!"
"We had to make serious changes inside the engine to achieve these improvements. Unfortunately, this means that the new transmission will not retrofit to previous model years."
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Cruiser
Posts: 88
Nova Scotia , Canada | Victory also cut a few corners with the '11.
Hey Jeff, what corners did they cut on the 11's
thanks Don |
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Visionary
Posts: 1229
Rancho Cucamonga, CA | So, the only reason for the 2.5k changes, is so you can find neutral easier? |
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Visionary
Posts: 1632
Jasper, MO | nice rides - 2011-02-27 11:37 AM
Victory also cut a few corners with the '11.
thanks Don
The '11 I looked at on the showroom floor had cables to hold up the saddlebag lids, where my '08 has gas struts. When did they start that?
Ronnie |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 802
| They deleted the gas cylinders with the '11 model year. I've had both and I prefer the latest without the gas cylinders. The doors open and close quicker and feel lighter. The factory rep said that the cylinders were causing some fit problems as well.
Marc |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 49
Fort Defiance, VA United States | I haven't seem them, but I'm assuming the 10's and earlier could be retrofitted? |
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2011 Transmissions and Service Questions