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New Mexico | So, as I consider making the switch, I was wondering about warranty/insurance issues regarding a car tire on a motorcycle. I have 4 1/2 years of warranty left, so do not want to do anything to void. Or be stuck owing thousands of dollars because the insurance company won't pay.
Will the insurance company deny your claim because you were not using factory authorized tires?
It sounds like ds tires grip the road much better during acceleration and braking.
Will this put more stress on the transmission and belt, voiding warranty?
More stress on brake calipers & frame, voiding warranty?
From what I have read, if your dealer doesn't back you up I could see the warranty company claiming the added stress on the frame caused flexing that made the headlight assembly start leaking.
Granted, I am paranoid, but this is a major investment that I plan on keeping 10+years, so want to cover all the bases if I can.
Edited by Boots 2010-10-03 3:22 PM
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Pittsburgh, PA | 2 of the insurance companies I have been with said as long as the tire is D.O.T. approved then it meets requirements. Inspection frhmy state only states d.o.t. approved tire,Not motorcycle tire.. |
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Akron Ohio area | As far as insurance goes, call them, then get it in writing.
Same with the company that you have the warranty with.
Everything else is just here-say. |
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Pittsburgh, PA | i seriously doubt they are going to hand write anyone any legal letter.. the most they will do is send you a copy of your rights depends on your state. nationwide and state farm said to me as long as it meets D.O.T. standards and has the d.o.t. markings on the tires. (which they do) |
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Moravia, IA | No....I havent worried. DOT approved tire......near as I can tell a non-issue from every insurance company Ive heard from (including mine).
As far as warranty, Ive had my bike to the dealer and never had a single issue......the tire was a non-issue. Im sure other DarkVision owners have done the same.
Edited by aaronrkelly 2010-10-04 3:01 AM
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Akron Ohio area | If your insurance company finds out that you broke the below rule, I can pretty much assure you that your claim will be denied.
To determine the allowable range of rim widths for a specific tire size, the TRA Yearbook or the manufacturer's guide should always be consulted for that specific tire?there is no "rule of thumb."[15] Running a tire on a rim size or type not approved by its manufacturer can result in tire failure and a loss of vehicle control. |
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Pittsburgh, PA | at my old house my X girlfriend had a motorcycle accident. slide under a van. The insurance company never even inspected the bike. all they did was come out to see the damage and the damage to her clothing and wrote a check with in minutes. they didnt even want to see if her tires were the cause of the accident (bald). They werent concerned with that at all. this was through Progressive insurance. |
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Akron Ohio area | See if the insurance adjuster is still so lazy if you cause an accident that totals a semi-truck or Corvette or worse still, kills someone.
D.O.T. ratings are only good for the intended type vehicle they were designed for. P=passenger vehicle, LT=light truck, MC=motorcycle)
A sub 10 grand insurance claim and a $1,000,000 insurance claim are going to be treated differently.
Buy a $20,000 + motorcycle and then complain about tire prices?
Reminds me of my buddy who's parents bought him a Vette.
He loved to burn rubber with it, then had sticker shock when he found out each tire cost in excess of $500.
He couldn't afford it and sold it. |
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New Bohemia, VA | ... a hundred years ago I had someone push my CB750 over from the left side and the kick got caught under the bumber and bent. A few scratches were on the bike, but I had it trailered to the local honda place. I just wanted them to check the frame out to make sure there was nothing safety wise. Before I know it the insurance company had totaled it. I was curious what was wrong and when they cited everything I discovered it was still ridable. So I took the bike and the lessor amount from the totaled amount and rode that bike another 3 years. I came to the conclusion the dealer wanted it totaled, I'd take the check, they'd take the "salvaged title" and resell it for a nice sum. From an insurance perspective I don't think it is an issue, can't say from a warranty perspective though.
Edited by varyder 2010-10-04 12:35 PM
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Pitt Meadows, BC Canada | bigfoot - 2010-10-04 10:23 AM See if the insurance adjuster is still so lazy if you cause an accident that totals a semi-truck or Corvette or worse still, kills someone. D.O.T. ratings are only good for the intended type vehicle they were designed for. P=passenger vehicle, LT=light truck, MC=motorcycle) A sub 10 grand insurance claim and a $1,000,000 insurance claim are going to be treated differently. Buy a $20,000 + motorcycle and then complain about tire prices? Reminds me of my buddy who's parents bought him a Vette. He loved to burn rubber with it, then had sticker shock when he found out each tire cost in excess of $500. He couldn't afford it and sold it. Yeah. Mine was +$30k. Replaced tires at Victory dealership - same as stock - cost me $500 for front and rear. Darkside might save a few hundred over a few years - not worth it in my opinion. |
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Pittsburgh, PA | bigfoot - 2010-10-04 12:23 PM
See if the insurance adjuster is still so lazy if you cause an accident that totals a semi-truck or Corvette or worse still, kills someone.
D.O.T. ratings are only good for the intended type vehicle they were designed for. P=passenger vehicle, LT=light truck, MC=motorcycle)
A sub 10 grand insurance claim and a $1,000,000 insurance claim are going to be treated differently.
Buy a $20,000 + motorcycle and then complain about tire prices?
Reminds me of my buddy who's parents bought him a Vette.
He loved to burn rubber with it, then had sticker shock when he found out each tire cost in excess of $500.
He couldn't afford it and sold it.
whats the differnet of a guy running a new car tire and getting into a accident VS a guy running a mc tire that is bald and getting into a accident? will the insurance NOT pay the claim? is there a disclaimer stating properly maintenance for insurance is void? |
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Pitt Meadows, BC Canada | A bald MC tire can have more traction than a brand new car tire. That is due to the rubber compounds used - most car tires are designed with hard-rubber compounds to give a long mileage life. They can be made with more agressive tread designs and wider stance to make up for the loss in traction.
The bald MC tire will lose it quicker in wet or slippery conditions - but tread is not necessarily a 'must' since tread is mostly used to get traction on rougher surfaces - such as gravel or dirt - or rough asphalt. That's why the brand-new MC tires don't have much tread compared to a darkside tire.
If car-tire design was superior to MC tire design, then that is what the manufacturers would use on new bikes - but they DON'T !!!!
Bike tires cost more, and wear out quicker. That's just 'life on a motorcycle' and for good reason.... |
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Pittsburgh, PA | donetracey - 2010-10-04 6:36 PM
A bald MC tire can have more traction than a brand new car tire. That is due to the rubber compounds used - most car tires are designed with hard-rubber compounds to give a long mileage life. They can be made with more agressive tread designs and wider stance to make up for the loss in traction.
The bald MC tire will lose it quicker in wet or slippery conditions - but tread is not necessarily a 'must' since tread is mostly used to get traction on rougher surfaces - such as gravel or dirt - or rough asphalt. That's why the brand-new MC tires don't have much tread compared to a darkside tire.
If car-tire design was superior to MC tire design, then that is what the manufacturers would use on new bikes - but they DON'T !!!!
Bike tires cost more, and wear out quicker. That's just 'life on a motorcycle' and for good reason....
that must be why alot of darksiders use sportscar tires. softer compound. instead of a all season 80K mile tire |
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| donetracey - 2010-10-04 7:36 PM
A bald MC tire can have more traction than a brand new car tire. That is due to the rubber compounds used - most car tires are designed with hard-rubber compounds to give a long mileage life. They can be made with more agressive tread designs and wider stance to make up for the loss in traction.
The bald MC tire will lose it quicker in wet or slippery conditions - but tread is not necessarily a 'must' since tread is mostly used to get traction on rougher surfaces - such as gravel or dirt - or rough asphalt. That's why the brand-new MC tires don't have much tread compared to a darkside tire.
If car-tire design was superior to MC tire design, then that is what the manufacturers would use on new bikes - but they DON'T !!!!
Bike tires cost more, and wear out quicker. That's just 'life on a motorcycle' and for good reason....
Everyone talks about the traction of a MC vs a CT but they fail to think about how much more of a contact patch with the ground the CT has. People who have switched have said braking on the CT is so much better. I plan on going Darkside when this tire wears out. |
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New Mexico | Ok, then it is settled - I'm going Darkside... Oh, wait, no, definitely not, no way....Umm, well, yes, for sure I'm going to do it....Hold on a second, not gonna do it... DAMN, I'm so confused!! |
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Pittsburgh, PA | somewhere on youtube there was a video on a goldwing with a cartire on it running through the DRAGON at unreal speeds. |
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Pitt Meadows, BC Canada | OH - I get it !!!
ALL the manufacturer's of bikes are in cahoots on this. They ALL get kickbacks from the tire makers so they keep us dumb bikers from knowing the truth! Darksiders are the only ones who know what's really going on! WOW !
A 'CONSPIRACY' !!!! Let's go get 'em, boys! Gotta love it!!!! Drag the insurance companies into this - that'll settle it....
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Akron, Ohio | Well I have read about all I could find out about CT vs MT. I agree with things from both sides and also disagree with things from both sides. I think the one point that seems to get forgotten is that CT are used on bikes with limited lean angles. Usually heavy cruisers and touring bikes. In this application they would do a great job. I am quite sure you will never see a CT on a sport bike that is riden like they are intended. Here in northern Ohio the roads are mostly flat and the best turns are exit and entrance ramps to the freeway. So in this area a CT seems like it would make more sense than an area like Tennessee where it is hard to find a straight road.
Sorry for my early morning ramble, but just my take on the whole thing. |
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New Bohemia, VA | donetracey - 2010-10-04 9:51 PM
OH - I get it !!!
ALL the manufacturer's of bikes are in cahoots on this. They ALL get kickbacks from the tire makers so they keep us dumb bikers from knowing the truth! Darksiders are the only ones who know what's really going on! WOW !
A 'CONSPIRACY' !!!! Let's go get 'em, boys! Gotta love it!!!! Drag the insurance companies into this - that'll settle it....
Calm down my Canuck friend, I'm still on your side. Let the darksiders ride, and ride on. I've teetered on the brink of crossing over on several occassions and a few things keeps me from going to see the wizzard of rubber.
1) Despite the claims of being so-called better, no one will deny that they ride different. I like my ride just the way it is, and better becomes a matter of persecption and objectivity.
2) I can still afford to buy motorcycle tires.
But from a stand point of nostalgia and motorcycle history, a car tire is not new on even the bad boy bikes when m/c tires were hard to find, or they just wanted extended use due to the lack of money. There wasn't a lot of emphasis back then on the ride of the bike, just that you rode, and misery was part of being a biker.
Those who perfer to darkside, I say more power to ya! Keep the updates coming as there are many who want to know as they too may folllow that path and be more than satisfied.
On the negative note, a friend who has more miles on a touring bike than most laughed when I asked him about a CT. His response.... he laughed and said "No way, you ever see one of them seperate? It rips the whole back end off." I didn't ask him anymore questions about it. |
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West Knoxville TN | I have to ask. When was the last time anyone had a modern radial CT separate at speed? |
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New Bohemia, VA | ...I was waiting for that question CM -- I was only sharing his response, but apparently he has seen it at least one time and enough for it to not to cross his mind as an option.
But on that note, my son just had a blow out, something I've not seen in a very long time. I had to rescue him and had a hundred miles to give him a good talkin' to in my mind about looking after his stuff, like checking air in his tires. My thought was he let his air run low and his tire blew from overheating. But when I saw the tire, and though he never knew my thoughts, I apologized for thinking that he was at fault. I was thankful he was okay, as he had a genuine blowout from striking something in the road and the tread had seperated from the base on a nearly new tire. I just learn to never say never, though that is often my mantra... |
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Brighton, TN | In answer to your ? yes, I have on more than one occassion. Less than a couple of years ago. The entire center section of tread departed ways with its sidewalls on my truck going across 20 with just the truck as a load. Kaboom, almost takes the fender with it. I wonder if the bike tires are made differently to explicitly keep that from happening. No i have no desire to change the tire, because I love the way the bike handles currently, so I stick with what I got, now OIL that's a different ?, shouldn't be! Oh yeah, that was with proper inflation, nice balance, and less than 6,000 miles on them and no extreme or odd handling or wear patterns to be had. I, of course, am just wondering.
A couple of guys at the shop I attend, have rode a bike with a car tire on it and the movement is not fluid at all if you like to run the twisties. Which I absolutely love. Does anybody know of a twisty track I can take my bike on and give it a spin. I don't know if I have the balls for damaging a 20k machine, but it seems like it would be fun.
Edited by pollolittle 2010-10-05 3:53 PM
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New Bohemia, VA | littlesmallchickenpeep are you runnin' car tread? |
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Memphis,Tn. | "Does anybody know of a twisty track I can take my bike on and give it a spin. I don't know if I have the balls for damaging a 20k machine, but it seems like it would be fun."
Pollo, let's sneak into the old motorsports park and ride the roadcourse until the blue flashing lights arrive.
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| I have a 2009 Vision and it was $18,500. When I went to get a new rear tire the local dealer charged me $300 just for the tire and $20 to install it on the rim. Just because someone pays thousands for a motorcycle does not mean they should have to spend $300 for a tire that may last 10,000. I want value for my money and there is no reason for the high price of a motorcycle tire other than greed. Personally I wasn't impressed with the radial tire, seems like you give up grip for longevity. Does anyone change their Victory tires themselves and what do they use?
Thank God for motorcyclists! and keep the rubber side down.
Steve |
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Tacoma, WA | Seems there are some 'experts' who like to put out "facts" that have no basis. The fact is, car tire tread is SOFTER than motorcycle tread, and, yes, tread is indeed NEEDED. If tread was not needed on pavement, there wouldn't be any. On a closed-course race track, yes, tread is minimal, as conditions are as good as possible (no rain, track kept free of debris, etc) and traction is best when contact patch is larger, so less tread is desirable. Add in the real world, where we all ride, and the variables require tread. Rain, any oil, or fuel on the roadway, and tread becomes a godsend. A car tire has that in spades. Even in a corner, it is more than a motorcycle tire. All that being said, I ride with E-3's on my Vision, because of the great mileage I get, and the lack of hassle from shops, who don't like to mount tires other than M/C on bikes. I do have one on one of my shaft driven bikes, though, as they seem to tear through tires really quickly.-------Metalguy |
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| Darkside vs Warranty Question
Keep in mind that if you run a car tire and something happens. They would have to prove in a court of law that the car tire and you were at fault. Something goes bad on the motor or light or radio I don't think tire would have any thing to do with it. God for bid if you were in a accident they still would have to prove the tire was at fault. Yes they would have there experts say no to car tire on bike but then you have thousands of darkside rides saying there wrong.
http://www.impalaclub.com/naisso/magmoss.htm |
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| donetracey - 2010-10-04 8:51 PM
OH - I get it !!!
ALL the manufacturer's of bikes are in cahoots on this. They ALL get kickbacks from the tire makers so they keep us dumb bikers from knowing the truth! Darksiders are the only ones who know what's really going on! WOW !
A 'CONSPIRACY' !!!! Let's go get 'em, boys! Gotta love it!!!! Drag the insurance companies into this - that'll settle it....
Conspiracy = business model, and all successful companies follow successful business models. Manufactures continue to make money long after they sell a bike through service and parts, and their viability depends on this. So it is to their benefit to make parts that have to be replaced over the course of ownership. Now what I find very interesting is that the 2 tires on a motorcycle are comparable in cost to the 4 tires on a car, based on a reduced yearly mileage due to seasonal riding. A successful business model at work. Now what happens to us riders who exceed that average riding season – we incur more cost compared to the average car for wearable parts – is that fair? Doesn’t matter, it is business, but like most people I have a limited budget and costs have gone up while our pay hasn’t. Many preach the dangers of going to a car tire, but why isn’t the US DOT warning us of the dangers about using a car tire on a motorcycle? They have had plenty of time to warn us. The answer is simple, there is no risk, and the US DOT knows there is no risk. Keep in mind tire classification is not a requirement. The US DOT only “requires” us to use tires that have the proper loading capability, and that is why you will not see a MT on a car, now that is a risk. Now that this thread is completely jacked, I think I can get us back on track. Lemon laws state that a MFG has to prove that a deviation from recommended replacement part was the “direct” cause of a said failure, and in the case of a tire that could prove to be extremely difficult for the MFG. There was a time in our history of transportation that you could not tell the difference between CTs and MTs, but as cars got bigger and heavier, the tires needed to support that weight also changed. Look at the pictures below, can you tell me which tire is the CT, and which is the MT?
Edited by sgiacci 2011-04-10 2:04 AM
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New Bohemia, Va | trick question - too bad they are tires for vehicles not designed and produced in the last decade... |
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Salisbury, NC | I'm on my second C/T. I had a little over 23,000 miles on the first one, hope to get the same or better out of this one. The only weak link in the drivetrain that I have found so far is the bolt that holds the front sprocket on. There is a large lock ring that holds that bolt in place and I spun the bolt in the lock ring which made the front sprocket pull the belt into the engine block. I replaced both front and rear sprocket along with the belt. It has been great since. I like the fact that you can hear the tire spinning through 5th gear, but I am sure that had nothing to do with me spinning the bolt in the lock ring. ET |
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New Bohemia, Va | only 23,000? What is the tire rated at for mileage. I had figure it would be more along the lines of 50,000 to 70,000. |
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| goodgeorge - 2011-03-08 9:27 AM
I have a 2009 Vision and it was $18,500. When I went to get a new rear tire the local dealer charged me $300 just for the tire and $20 to install it on the rim. Just because someone pays thousands for a motorcycle does not mean they should have to spend $300 for a tire that may last 10,000. I want value for my money and there is no reason for the high price of a motorcycle tire other than greed. Personally I wasn't impressed with the radial tire, seems like you give up grip for longevity. Does anyone change their Victory tires themselves and what do they use?
Thank God for motorcyclists! and keep the rubber side down.
SteveTo answer the question:"does anyone change their Victory tires themselves?" in a word "yes."
In 40 years of riding I have never paid anyone to change a MC tire for me. $300/tire, I think not. My last Avon Cobra cost less than $200 and $0 labor to change. I do not have any fancy equipment, just a set of MC tire irons passed down to me by my great uncle. |
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Moravia, IA | He may have changed it just to try out another tire.....Darksiders are commonly tinkerer's like that. 
Ive got 26K on a Bridgestone Potenza and it looks like 60% or better tread - Im still running it. |
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| Cap'n Nemo - 2011-04-10 5:19 AM
trick question - too bad they are tires for vehicles not designed and produced in the last decade...
No it isn't.
I stated - "There was a time in our history of transportation that you could not tell the difference between CTs and MTs".
Well can you?
Your odds a very good at 50/50. |
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New Bohemia, Va | rather easy for most over 50, top tire is obviously for a 1940-50, somewhere around there, perhaps later, motorcycle tire. The second tire would be from the early century cars like the old model T's and the such, hard rubber. |
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Salisbury, NC | I think I mentioned that I like hearing the tire squall while changing gears. It wears the tread off all the way across the tire. ET |
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Moravia, IA |  |
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| Cap'n Nemo - 2011-04-10 9:15 PM
rather easy for most over 50, top tire is obviously for a 1940-50, somewhere around there, perhaps later, motorcycle tire. The second tire would be from the early century cars like the old model T's and the such, hard rubber.
Nice... You hit it on the head for the car tire, but the bike is off just by a hair. The bike tire is for a 1930-40 bike, but still and very good shot. |
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New Bohemia, Va | sgiacci - 2011-04-11 8:30 PM
Cap'n Nemo - 2011-04-10 9:15 PM
rather easy for most over 50, top tire is obviously for a 1940-50, somewhere around there, perhaps later, motorcycle tire. The second tire would be from the early century cars like the old model T's and the such, hard rubber.
Nice... You hit it on the head for the car tire, but the bike is off just by a hair. The bike tire is for a 1930-40 bike, but still and very good shot.
I would say later also, this guy has a thing for authenticity on his '48 Harley. I've not done any "googling" to substansiate anything but I would give the tire a little more time in use...
Edited by Cap'n Nemo 2011-04-12 9:15 AM
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