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Tourer
Posts: 460
Centennial, CO | This bike purrs at 70...but I want it to purr at 80 with about the same RPMs as at 70. A smaller pulley maybe? Do they make one? If so, what are the advantages...??? |
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Visionary
Posts: 1484
LaPorte,Tx. | I know there is an over drive primary sprocket for the Kingpin. This may fit on the Vision. You may want to snoop around a Kingpin site. I've talked to my tire guy and he said some of the motorcycle policeman in the Houston are use the E-3 Dunlap 180/70-R16 which has a larger aspect ratio than the 180/60-R16 that is stock. The police like it because is gives them a little more ground clearance, which give a little more lean before touching something down. But, with the larger diameter of the tire, 24.39" vs. 26.06" the bigger tire should drop the rpm at any speed. My issue with this is slow riding. In order to do a 5 mph crawl now in traffic, I'm on the clutch a lot. This would make that even worse. I would think that some of those using car tires may aready see a lower rpm. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 725
Reno County, KS | Hey Jim. Won't that mess up your speedo calibration? I've been thinking about that too. |
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Tourer
Posts: 432
Gettysburg, 2008 Tour Premium | The last thing I would do to my Vision is change the Vision gearing. Does anyone even make a speedo recalibrator? I believe you would ultimatly make the bike slower and harder to keep torque numbers up. If you want the bike to purr at higher speeds look to changing exhaust and Lloyds intake plate and controller. The sound and feedback from the engine with simple mods is very positive. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 725
Reno County, KS | He's got all that installed. We are looking at re-gearing a bike with fuel controller, intake and warm cams. Speedo recal? I seriously doubt it for the Vision.
Edited by bigwill5150 2009-09-22 6:23 AM
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Tourer
Posts: 460
Centennial, CO | wroman - 2009-09-21 10:11 PM
The last thing I would do to my Vision is change the Vision gearing. Does anyone even make a speedo recalibrator? I believe you would ultimatly make the bike slower and harder to keep torque numbers up. If you want the bike to purr at higher speeds look to changing exhaust and Lloyds intake plate and controller. The sound and feedback from the engine with simple mods is very positive.
Please note - all answered in my signature block.
Changing the cams...etc. does nothing for RPM. While I agree that I might run into issues at the slow end of life, I don't do a lot of in-town riding. So, this is a moot point to me. I want a better RPM to speed ratio for long hauling which I do quite a bit. Most of my in-town riding is not during high traffic times.
As for speedo...I can use my GPS to know where I am. |
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Tourer
Posts: 432
Gettysburg, 2008 Tour Premium | Having ridden a late model 96" cubic inch H-D Ultra for a couple of years before the Vision I think the Vision gearing is as good as it gets. The Harley was actually OK in town, everywhere alse it was unacceptable. |
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Jacksonville Florida | If we are talking drive pulley to drop the RPM you have to increase the front drive from the standard 33 tooth to the 35 tooth. I have the 35 tooth installed on my Vision. You will have to give the inside of the cover some extra clearance for the belt to clear. I used a Dremal tool. Dropped the RPM on the high side by 400. Can't really tell any difference in acceleration from a dead stop. Conquest Customs in Palm Beach Fl. can hook you up. It is my understanding that Corey Ness did this to his Vision and that's why I decided to give it a try. |
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Tourer
Posts: 460
Centennial, CO | Len,
Thanks for the information. Just what I was looking for.
I would say a 2 tooth gain in front is about equal to 5 or 6 drop in the rear.
I was thinking of doing the rear pulley only rather than working on the front for ease of access...dropping the tire and doing the work their rather than working at the tranny side. Oh well! Sounds like just a bit more work but also worth it.
I will touch base with the guys you suggested and get the overall idea and see if its worth it.
Thanks! |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 725
Reno County, KS | Hey, keep us(me) updated on this. I've been thinking about it and have not decided to persue it yet for reasons stated. I'd like to know how your bike performs and handles with this mod. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1436
| smaller pulley front or rear will reduce torque a little but be a little quicker at the same revs which is what your asking. one tooth front is equal to 2 on the rear. Shouldn't hurt your bike a bit. I would look at the Kingpin options to see if you can find what you want. |
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Tourer
Posts: 432
Gettysburg, 2008 Tour Premium | Will you need a different belt? I think you are attempting to fix something that is not broken. The Vision is not adverse to turning RPM. There is always a side effect to whatever you do. I gaeantee you that if you drop RPM enough to make a difference you will find yourself needing to shift between 4'th and 5'th in situaltions where 5'th gear would be good enough. Or the taller gearing will possibly be harder on the stock clutch when 'getting on it.' What does the bike do or not do that makes you believe that taller gearing would fix it? Is it noise? Is it vibration? Did it act the same before the cam? Are you comparing the Vision to another bike and concluding "if only I turned a few less R's it would be more like XXXX bike?" Modifying any aspect of a bike can often put us on a never ending series of changes made to fix something that the previuos change created. That is what attracted me to the Vision. By the way most people here will sort of egg you on to make changes just so they will have something to talk about. I don't think anyone has any bad intentions it is just that there is so little done to these bike that it is interesting to talk about potential modifications. I wish someone would buy Thundercones mufflers so I can find out if the fit of the stock heat shields is good and if they are too loud for real touring.
Edited by wroman 2009-09-28 11:06 AM
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Iron Butt
Posts: 619
Southeast Iowa | wroman
Don't assume just because it came from the factory a certain way that it is best way or suits everyone's needs. We are talking about 2 teeth on the drive pulley............not exactly something that will screw the bike up. I say if ElroyJ wants less RPM's then go for it! I know people that have done this to Vic's with the 5 speed tranny and love it. Personally I think the should come from the factory this way. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1436
| I was just thinking about clearance on the front pulley. You guys do know that Ness sells an open pulley cover right? I saw one on a low liner and it is way cool and clean. Might be something to think about if you plan to go bigger on the front pulley, or if you tend to get a bunch of dirt packed in your current cover.
Oh and you'll have to excuse my brain fart; bigger not smaller. The rule is 1 tooth change on front is equal to 2 teeth on the rear. In the dirt bike world most folks swap rear before going to the front. |
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Tourer
Posts: 354
20 miles west of Chicago. | Regarding the taller tire, I seem to remember someone posting something about that and saying they ran into a clearence problem. |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 23
Fort Worth | I have an '05 Kingpin with the 5-speed tranny...... I messed with the over-drive pulley quite a bit so I will tell you what I know.....
The '04-'05 Kingpin comes stock with a 30-tooth pulley. The aftermarket over-drive pulley has 32 teeth. If you can find one and don't mind grinding on your engine case just a tad for clearance, it works great. The '06 and newer Kingpin comes with a 33-tooth front pulley. I tried to install one of those before going to the more-expensive aftermarket pulley. It would not fit for two reasons: (1) the tranny output shaft has a slightly difference spline and (2) there is not enough clearance inside the pulley cover for a 33-tooth pulley.
I have not messed with the pulley on my Vision and don't intend to because I'm happy with it like it is, but I'm going to speculate that there is not a Kingpin pulley out there that will fit the Vision.
Regarding speedometer calibration: The speedo gets its signal from a mag pickup near the front pulley that counts the teeth as they go by. If you swap out the front pulley with a larger one the speedo will still read accurately. If you change out the rear pulley your speedo will not read correctly. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 725
Reno County, KS | Thanks for the info on the speedo cal. I was wondering where exactly it was picking off the speed. Sooo. If I drop my gear ratio and go the other direction (31 tooth) or ElroyJ raises his (35 tooth primary), it will not affect the speedo unless we mess with the rear pulley and/or tire O.D.
Len Rhymes: This would suggest that your speedo never went out of cal. Can you confirm or do you suspect this is the case too? |
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Cruiser
Posts: 111
| I just put 600 miles on my 2011 Vision 8-Ball and was real excited to find this thread. For me, it's geared too low for a crosscountry cruiser, which is how I ride. The idea of the 35 tooth pulley is great if I could find one! Ness's V-1250 is for the early model 5-speed trans. I've contacted Turbo Tec and their's too is for the 5-speed (dispite what the add says). So I ask, where the hell do you find one for the later 6-speed trans?! |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 721
| .
Edited by Travelin Man 2011-09-09 6:41 AM
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| Dakota Digital makes a recalibration for speed-O's Before you start doing all your pulley changes look for a belt that will be the hard part.
Edited by john frey 2011-09-09 11:25 AM
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Cruiser
Posts: 111
| Why recalibrate? The pick up sensor is on the back side of the front pulley. Other than moving it to keep the same clearance, it should read the same. If I changed the rear pulley, it would be effected. It's a good point on the belt. So far no one has mentioned it but not wanting to dig threw every part manual known to man, I went out and measured. It should be fine with the stock belt. The quest continues! Thanks for the input, it's the details that get you. |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 37
Dayton, OH | Len, how much was the 35 tooth drive pulley and was there and adjustments/modification to accomodate the speedo pickup?? |
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Drive Pulley??