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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 30
Tampa, FL | I was just told that Victory has discovered that using Amsoil has created clutch problems on some Visions. Has anyone else heard this, or worse yet, experienced it?
I bought a cast of Amsoil gallons, plus 4 quarts to cover me for awhile. I'd hate to have to switch oil before using all of it.
Thanks
Mike |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 935
Rockford, IL |
I'd like some more info........
Who told you this? Dealer? Dealer technician? Next door nieghbor? The German Shepard down the street?
Under what "conditions" were you told this? Was this person attempting to sway you into purchasing another brand of oil?
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Visionary
Posts: 1350
| 100,000 using Amsoil in my '99 and '03 and no problems.
Amsoil recommends using the 10w40 in Victory.
What oil does the dumbass that told you this sell?
Then again they would be correct if some dumbass put the non-motorcycle oil in.
Maybe this is all a scam just to start another oil thread?????? |
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | I use amsoil 10w40 motorcycle oil in my vision since 600 miles. I right now have just under 5000 miles with No problems with my clutches. Amsoil even lists that their oil is made for wet clutches... |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 30
Tampa, FL | I heard it from a friend, and who knows where he heard it. He has no connection with any oil company, it was just a passing statement and I wondered if anyone else had heard it.
That's all, nothing more...
Mike |
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Cruiser
Posts: 87
Lusby,Md | The "non-motorcycle oil" you speak of don't have the anti-wear additives that the so called motorcycle oil has.I've ran plain automotive oil in all the motorcycles I've owned and have not had any problems what so ever.I'm running Royal Purple 20-50 in my T/C and my Vision with no problems,the T/C has 30,000 and the Vision has 15,000 miles.So no matter what oil you use,the thing is ,JUST KEEP IT CHANGED. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 72
Eyota, MN | I'm running Amsoil 20w50 in my Vision and it works great, not much difference in the viscosity of victorys 20w40 and the amsoil 20w50 plus the amsoil should have a better pour point because it's full synthetic not a blend. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 238
SF Bay Area | No.
Amsoil, or any quality synthetic is fine. Roadkill has over 200k on his Vic, using Amsoil. Nuf' said. |
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Tourer
Posts: 576
, IA | 42,000 in my t.c not problems 7000+ in my vision and my dealer said it work fine |
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Cruiser
Posts: 59
| before posting such comments on on this board it would be nice to have proof of such. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 244
Fargo, ND | I don't believe he was making a comment. He was asking opinions...if anyone else had heard a similar comment. Thanks to all who answered. |
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Tourer
Posts: 353
| MangoMike - 2008-12-08 11:06 AM
I was just told that Victory has discovered that using Amsoil has created clutch problems on some Visions. Has anyone else heard this, or worse yet, experienced it?
I bought a cast of Amsoil gallons, plus 4 quarts to cover me for awhile. I'd hate to have to switch oil before using all of it.
Thanks
Mike
Must be a rumor, just make sure you get the M/C rated oil, as the M/C oil has none of the friction modifiers like you would find in automotive oil. |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 17
Summerfield, NC | I know this does not address the actual post, but I did want to mention that after the 500 mile service, I put in Amsoil 20-50. At 3,000 miles I put Victory's oil and even at 30° the bike shifts smoother. However their is no difference in the response of the clutch. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1290
Ruskin, Fl | I'm at almost 11,000 right now and I am using full synthetic motorcycle designed for a wet clutch. With the Victory oil my clutch started to get "grabby" at around 2200 miles. I am at about 2700 on my current oil and it is still smooth. Also since I made the change to synthetic a couple of changes ago, shifting is much smoother. That was noticeable almost immediately. The only reason I am not using Amsoil is I have to travel too far out of my way to buy it. |
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Tourer
Posts: 506
Woodland Hills, CA | Please forgive my ignorance, but is there something wrong with the Victory oil (other than perhaps price) that leads so many to change to Amsoil, or some other fully synthetic? Is Amsoil really all that much of an improvement? |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 619
Southeast Iowa | Wizard523
IMO yes! Amsoil or any other full synthetic is a better oil than Victory's and the same or less. Try it and you'll know what everyone is talking about. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 74
MN. | BlueOx USA - 2008-12-08 2:30 PM
100,000 using Amsoil in my '99 and '03 and no problems.
Amsoil recommends using the 10w40 in Victory.
What oil does the dumbass that told you this sell?
Then again they would be correct if some dumbass put the non-motorcycle oil in.
Maybe this is all a scam just to start another oil thread??????
Also have close to 100,000 on my '99 and my '02 TCD. Zero problems. |
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Jacksonville Florida | When you buy the "Victory Oil" you are purchaseing a blended oil made by Mobile Oil otherwise known as Mobile 1.
I used the Repsol Oil before changing to Amsoil. Between the 3 I prefer the Amsoil mainly because of the tinsil strength rating. It is far better than any other oil made for motorcycles. |
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Tourer
Posts: 311
Atlanta Area | 8,000 miles on my Vision, 7,500 of those with Amsoil. I ride hard and I am very hard on the clutch. No problems whatsoever.... |
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Cruiser
Posts: 238
SF Bay Area | Len Rhymes - 2008-12-11 4:43 PM
When you buy the "Victory Oil" you are purchaseing a blended oil made by Mobile Oil otherwise known as Mobile 1.
I used the Repsol Oil before changing to Amsoil. Between the 3 I prefer the Amsoil mainly because of the tinsil strength rating. It is far better than any other oil made for motorcycles.
Actually, the Victory oil is sourced from a Minnesota based company name Lubri-Tech
http://www.lube-tech.com/history.html
A Vic mechanic friend of mine was in MN for a technical training session and when they drove to the location his Polaris trainer pointed across the street to Lubri-Tech and said "those are the folks that make your Victory oil". |
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Cruiser
Posts: 79
Austin, Texas | Interesting. A Victory dealer told me that Victory oil is Mobil One.
I ran Amsoil 20W50 in my Kingpin which made it shift better. I haven't yet changed the Vision over but that's next. |
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | I know at one time honda's oil was made by Mobil, NOT mobil 1. but even then it was only made to honda specs it wasnt the same oil as mobil 1. There arent that many true oil makers out there, so companies like Victory and other motorcycle companies have to have their oil made by a oil company. They just have it blend/created to their specs. In most cases it is over priced and doesnt meet the same level of performance that a full synth oil would. I use amsoil in my vision. just recently i tried that victory oil change kit. I didnt ride the motorcycle with yet. The only reason i choose the victory oil change kit was it was within a few miles of my house. Unlike amsoil which is a good distance away. I will go back to amsoil next year once i can make a road trip. Until then i will use the victory blend 20w40 oil .. At least this way i can see if i "feel" a difference going from a A1 top of the line oil, to the victory oil. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1340
Gainesville Fl Home of the Gators | buddahead - 2008-12-13 3:40 AM
Len Rhymes - 2008-12-11 4:43 PM
When you buy the "Victory Oil" you are purchaseing a blended oil made by Mobile Oil otherwise known as Mobile 1.
I used the Repsol Oil before changing to Amsoil. Between the 3 I prefer the Amsoil mainly because of the tinsil strength rating. It is far better than any other oil made for motorcycles.
Actually, the Victory oil is sourced from a Minnesota based company name Lubri-Tech
http://www.lube-tech.com/history.html
A Vic mechanic friend of mine was in MN for a technical training session and when they drove to the location his Polaris trainer pointed across the street to Lubri-Tech and said "those are the folks that make your Victory oil".
+1 on the Lubri Tech. Vic oil has nothin to do with Mobil.
To answer the question earlier about why people change. It is simple. Lay people like to belive they know more then the mechanicle, and chemicle engineers that designed the bikes, and speced the lubes. That way they can use things that don't save a penny, and feel good about themselves |
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Cruiser
Posts: 297
VA | After I did some reading I decided to try the Shell Rotella T synthetic oil. As I figured out, car oil has friction modifiers in it, which "might" be bad for wet cluth bikes. Shell Rotella T is made for diesel engines and has no modifiers. I will say, I think that my shifting is smoother with the Rotella. But, I can't say it's that noticeable. I tried it because my Victory dealer is over 1 hr away and a $3 toll charge, and Wal-Mart is everywhere (that's why they are the evil empire). I think a lot of people agree, any oil will most likely work fine as long as you change it. At least, that's what I've gathered. I've never heard anyone say that my engine blew up because I used a cheaper oil. I'm sure someone probably can, but I think it's rare, and there are so many factors, I doubt you could conclusively say it was because of the oil. But, I'm not an engineer. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1340
Gainesville Fl Home of the Gators | In a hybrid oil\air cooled motor the oils ability to TRANSFER HEAT both from metal, and to the heat sink[cooler] is very important. Sure your motor may not blow up, but is it getting hot spots, is it pulling heat off the back of the exhaust valve? |
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Visionary
Posts: 1484
LaPorte,Tx. | divesharc - 2008-12-19 10:49 PM
After I did some reading I decided to try the Shell Rotella T synthetic oil. As I figured out, car oil has friction modifiers in it, which "might" be bad for wet cluth bikes. Shell Rotella T is made for diesel engines and has no modifiers. I will say, I think that my shifting is smoother with the Rotella. But, I can't say it's that noticeable. I tried it because my Victory dealer is over 1 hr away and a $3 toll charge, and Wal-Mart is everywhere (that's why they are the evil empire). I think a lot of people agree, any oil will most likely work fine as long as you change it. At least, that's what I've gathered. I've never heard anyone say that my engine blew up because I used a cheaper oil. I'm sure someone probably can, but I think it's rare, and there are so many factors, I doubt you could conclusively say it was because of the oil. But, I'm not an engineer.
Yes, there is a good chance you will not see any effect from using any oil. But you must remember the oil is lubricating an air cooled motor, even though is has an oil cooler it is still an air cooled oil cooler and the clutch/transmission. Regular motor oils (not synthetic based) break down quickly due to heat, and if they are a cheap motor oil they have less additives that may protect it from the heat and shear. Most motor oils are not blended for shear. Most motorcycle oils have additives that withstand the shear of the transmission. If you ride low miles per year and don't plan on keeping the motorcycle long term. Most 20W-50 motor oils will work. But if you live in a high temp areas, stuck in traffic a lot, put on a lot of miles on your bike, push the oil change mileage, and want to keep the bike a long time........I would suggest putting a good motorcycle oil in your motorcycle. And, I'm and engineer. |
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Tourer
Posts: 353
| divesharc - 2008-12-19 8:49 PM
After I did some reading I decided to try the Shell Rotella T synthetic oil. As I figured out, car oil has friction modifiers in it, which "might" be bad for wet cluth bikes.
I didn't notice anyone posting that they were putting car oil in their bikes, it would not be good as you say because of th friction modifiers. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1324
So Cal | Mobil 1 has a good explanation of the diffrences of motorcycle oil vs motor oil. Friction modifiers and all that junk. Regardless of what oil you use, its worth reading. My opinion? Any oil is better than none at all. Clean oil is better than dirty oil. If your oil is low or dirty and the brand you use is not available on the road. Any clean oil will do in a pinch. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 296
Central Florida | cjnoho - 2008-12-20 3:12 PM
Mobil 1 has a good explanation of the diffrences of motorcycle oil vs motor oil. Friction modifiers and all that junk. Regardless of what oil you use, its worth reading. My opinion? Any oil is better than none at all. Clean oil is better than dirty oil. If your oil is low or dirty and the brand you use is not available on the road. Any clean oil will do in a pinch.
+1
Amsoil in my Vision since 2K. changed every 2500 miles up to current 25K+
no problems or issues at all! |
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Jacksonville Florida | Did somemore research on Lube-Tech. Since they don't own an oil well they purchase their base stock from a large company add a few things and then package the product for their private label customers "VICTORY". If you look at their web site what do you see? Bottles of Mobile 1. I would think this would indicate who their supplier is. What I know for sure is this VICTORY crap looks like crap when you drain it and the synthetics that I have used do not. NO CLUTCH PROBLEMS EITHER. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1340
Gainesville Fl Home of the Gators | Len Rhymes - 2008-12-20 7:39 PM
Did somemore research on Lube-Tech. Since they don't own an oil well they purchase their base stock from a large company add a few things and then package the product for their private label customers "VICTORY". If you look at their web site what do you see? Bottles of Mobile 1. I would think this would indicate who their supplier is. What I know for sure is this VICTORY crap looks like crap when you drain it and the synthetics that I have used do not. NO CLUTCH PROBLEMS EITHER.
Interesting thing, If you READ the blurb where they have the picture of Mobil1. You will find that lube-tech SUPPLIES it to Mobil. Now you see that makes me think....Why would the company that supplies Mobil it's full synthetic oil; spec a semi synth for Victory?? Seems to me it would have been easier, and more cost effective to relabel the full. As to having an oil well so what? International distribution of oil has changed that whole dynamic |
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Jacksonville Florida | Here again read the fine print. In the company bio Lube Tech states that Lube Tech serves private label customers in specialty markets that includes packaging. I would think that means it's cheaper for Lube Tech to package a Mobile 1 product than it is for Mobile Oil to do it. So, they still have to get the original product from someone and my money is on Mobile 1. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 297
VA | VisionTex,
The reason that I threw in the reference to the friction modifiers is that vic2004-08 stated:
'The "non-motorcycle oil" you speak of don't have the anti-wear additives that the so called motorcycle oil has.I've ran plain automotive oil in all the motorcycles I've owned and have not had any problems what so ever.I'm running Royal Purple 20-50 in my T/C and my Vision with no problems,the T/C has 30,000 and the Vision has 15,000 miles.So no matter what oil you use,the thing is ,JUST KEEP IT CHANGED.'
I was trying to show that it was almost the opposite, that car oil is supposed to be worse because it did have these friction modifiers, and some feel that it might be bad for a wet clutch. That was what made me throw that out there.
I agree about the synthetics. Not being an engineer, but trying to educate myself on the subject, and everyone seems to have their own opinion about oil. Hence all the "not another oil thread" comments that I have seen. I agree whole heartedly that synthetics in a motor cycle make more sense than in a normal passenger vehicle because of the heat. The break down of the oil in a conventional oil would be more damaging on a air cooled engine than a water cooled one. That is why I switched to a synthetic. I know that many might argue that Rotella T is not the right oil to use, but when I looked up the standards that they used to rate the oils, the only reason that Rotella T didn't get the higher rating was because of ash content. But, I read recently that the newer blend they are using meets or exceeds this standard now.
I will say that everyone seems very positive about the AmsOil. I am sure it is a great product, but there are no dealers close to me locally, and the price is also a consideration. It's not cheap. I know, I know, people will say you bought a $20K + bike and you'll skimp on the oil? Well, yeah. Until someone can really prove to me that unless I use Amsoil I am degrading the life of the engine by half, or will suffer some major problems, I can't see paying twice as much. I love my Vision and hope to have it for many, many years to come. But I also don't like spending money on something that I can't see tangible results, or compelling evidence that it will improve the longevity of the motor.
I would rather use a "cheaper" oil, and change it at the specified oil change intervals, which are extremely conservative IMHO. I don't put as many miles as some other on here, but I will probably average between 8-10K a year. And for me, that's a lot. At $20/gallon at Wal_mart, that is $80 a year not including oil filters. That's less than 1/2 the cost of using Amsoil. |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 8
cambridge springs pa | I'ved used Amsoil in all my toys, my business cars and trucks for the past 15 years. All with NO problems at all! I had a 06 Kingpin, and put over 20,000 miles on it and used Amsoil since the first oil change. I have an 08 Vision, and did the same. My company cars and trucks get better gas milage and have high miles on them, allwith NO engine problems! As for not having a local Amsiol dealer,I'm a dealer, and all you have to do is go online to the Amsoil site, put in my dealer #476826 and you can buy Amsoil at cost. It will delivered to your door. In my opinion Amsoil is the finest oil made! Ward |
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Visionary
Posts: 1436
| First off haven't heard that rumor for Victory but I've heard it said for over a decade. No truth to it at all.
Second, I have no idea who bottles the Victory oil, but I do know that after a bunch of testing with different oil combinations Victory decided on a semi-syn for the vision. I don't run it because it makes my gear box feel notchy.
Third I tried the mobil 1 and didn't notice any difference between it and the Victory semi-syn, so I switched to the Amsoil and there was a noticable difference. I've stuck with it since.
Lastly the Shell Rotella T is a good full synthetic and won't harm your bike one bit. Know guys with hundreds of thousands of miles using it. Doesn't hurt the pocket as much either, lol....
Listen if you want to know if any of the aforementioned oils are any good, open Lloyds front page tips and look at the oil brands he has listed. I can't say absolutely which they recommend but I highly doubt he'd advertise anything that would harm your bike. A good synthetic changed regularly is a very good choice, or run the Victory oil. If I've learned one thing about bike owners, it is that oil choice can really stir up a debate, so just run what you like. JMO |
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Amsoil Bad for the clutch?