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Cruiser
Posts: 53
Shelbyville, IL United States | I have a 2013 Vision. It has 5300 miles on it. The valves are really loud. The more miles I put on it the louder it gets. Sounds like a marble in a tin can. Is this normal ? It really dont bother me going down the road. I just want to know if every 106 motor sounds like this. Most valve rattle I have had on any bike I have owned. Thanks. |
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | in gear? while moving? any certain RPM range? what octane of fuel are you using? |
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Cruiser
Posts: 53
Shelbyville, IL United States | 93 octane. It rattles in gear idleing or going down the rode. |
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | i hate to ask this, but.. when was the last time the oil level was checked..? |
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | nvr is just funning with us. He checks his oil and has the right kind of oil at the right level. If he wasn't funning with us he'd done take it to the dealer before he got a piston in his chaps... |
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| yes go to dealer and do a compression test. I don't know if you can do a leak down test on a Vic but it would tell you if the valves are not seated right.
It they take the top end a part gut in cams it would be free labor.
Even call Rylan at the Vic shop and see what he says about the knock |
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Tourer
Posts: 573
Central Illinois | No way is a noise like that "normal". The way you describe it I would immediately think ping. That is why people are asking about octane ratings. A ping is often cured by raising octane. What mods have you done? Do you have any performance intake or exhaust mods? |
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Cruiser
Posts: 53
Shelbyville, IL United States | Stage 1 pipes air cleaner and download. Loyds timing wheel set at 4 degrees advance. It is not a knock it is valve noise. I have not been around any other victory bikes to listen to them. Maybe it is normal. It seems to be louder now that the weather has warmed up. I would think if it was pining it would not do it at idle. Yes oils just changed by me. Checked by me and checked by dealer again and checked by me yesterday. The oil is fine. Lastnight I took the timing cover off and was going to back the timing wheel down to 0 but I could not get it to move. Took the bolts comepletely out of the middle and it still would not move. Maybe I am missiong something. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 251
Mechanicsville, VA United States | Yeah it's not the middle bolt that allows the timing wheel to move it's the outter two bolts that do that.
Do what a lot of old timer Vic riders do Wear ear plugs, it makes for a much better ride.....all Vic's have lifter noise, some more then others, some not at all...........it's normal...... Vic's make noise......Vic motors are bullet proof..... the end! |
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | i know this is rare.. but a few years ago. my dealer had a 09 vision come in for noises.. they finally found something in the rear cylinder head.. right under the valve cover.. i cant remember exactly what it was. but i do remember being told it was a screw (very tiny) that came loose. it had something to do with the valves. ... it was one of these little screws http://parts.polarisind.com/images/VIC/VALVETRN/09VEGAS.gif im not saying he has the same issues.. but in the case of this guy at my dealer it as extremely rare and unheard of... i remember my dealer had to call victory for "help".
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Cruiser
Posts: 53
Shelbyville, IL United States | I am leaving for Florida Friday. I reckon if it gonna grenade it will do it then. It could be normal. It seems to be louder the warmer it is out. Gonna be 90 in Florida it should sound really bad then lol. |
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| new Vic rider
does the sound get louder the faster you go or does the noise stay the same from idle all the way to 60 or 70mph.
yes loosen two outer bolts to change timing do not go below zero
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Cruiser
Posts: 53
Shelbyville, IL United States | noise gets louder the faster I go. It is rpm related. I did loosen the 2 inside bolts and it would not move either way. Matter of fact took them all the way out and it still would not move. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 53
Shelbyville, IL United States | Wait not louder just speeds up. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 251
Mechanicsville, VA United States | I'm pretty sure the noise is a lifter and you may need to loosen the middle bolt and the two outter bolts to turn the timing gear.
Also I still recommend ear plugs, at least try them. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 135
Chesterfield, VA | new vic rider - 2014-04-22 11:17 PM noise gets louder the faster I go. It is rpm related. I did loosen the 2 inside bolts and it would not move either way. Matter of fact took them all the way out and it still would not move. Just trying to cover all bases on adjusting the timing wheel...you do realize that once you loosen the 2 bolts on the inner wheel, it's the inner wheel that you turn to adjust the timing and not the outer wheel that has what looks like gear teeth on it. The outer wheel is locked in place, you will not be able to turn that. Also want to point out that while a lot of people here seem to be able to run with their timing advanced by 4-6 degrees, I found that I had to bring mine all the way back to a +1 before I could eliminate the pinging under a load. If the noise you are hearing gets louder as the RPMs increase and as the ambient temperature increases, I wouldn't rule out the fact that your timing may be advanced too far for your motor. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1365
Central Maryland | sarvbill - 2014-04-23 7:25 AM
new vic rider - 2014-04-22 11:17 PM noise gets louder the faster I go. It is rpm related. I did loosen the 2 inside bolts and it would not move either way. Matter of fact took them all the way out and it still would not move. Just trying to cover all bases on adjusting the timing wheel...you do realize that once you loosen the 2 bolts on the inner wheel, it's the inner wheel that you turn to adjust the timing and not the outer wheel that has what looks like gear teeth on it.� The outer wheel is locked in place, you will not be able to turn that.� Also want to point out that while a lot of people here seem to be able to run with their timing advanced by 4-6 degrees, I found that I had to bring mine all the way back to a +1 before I could eliminate the pinging under a load.� If the noise you are hearing gets louder as the RPMs increase and as the ambient temperature increases, I wouldn't rule out the fact that your timing may be advanced too far for your motor. I have also been hearing some very mild pinging as of late, when I run my Vision under a load and the adjustable timing wheel set at +4 degree's. I think I am going to go back in to it and adjust it back a bit. |
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| sarvbill - 2014-04-23 6:25 AM new vic rider - 2014-04-22 11:17 PM noise gets louder the faster I go. It is rpm related. I did loosen the 2 inside bolts and it would not move either way. Matter of fact took them all the way out and it still would not move. Just trying to cover all bases on adjusting the timing wheel...you do realize that once you loosen the 2 bolts on the inner wheel, it's the inner wheel that you turn to adjust the timing and not the outer wheel that has what looks like gear teeth on it. The outer wheel is locked in place, you will not be able to turn that. Also want to point out that while a lot of people here seem to be able to run with their timing advanced by 4-6 degrees, I found that I had to bring mine all the way back to a +1 before I could eliminate the pinging under a load. If the noise you are hearing gets louder as the RPMs increase and as the ambient temperature increases, I wouldn't rule out the fact that your timing may be advanced too far for your motor. He is saying it wrong. Loosen the two outer bolts and the outer part of the wheel turns. The inner part of the wheel is stationary |
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| willtill - 2014-04-23 7:00 AM sarvbill - 2014-04-23 7:25 AM
new vic rider - 2014-04-22 11:17 PM noise gets louder the faster I go. It is rpm related. I did loosen the 2 inside bolts and it would not move either way. Matter of fact took them all the way out and it still would not move. Just trying to cover all bases on adjusting the timing wheel...you do realize that once you loosen the 2 bolts on the inner wheel, it's the inner wheel that you turn to adjust the timing and not the outer wheel that has what looks like gear teeth on it.� The outer wheel is locked in place, you will not be able to turn that.� Also want to point out that while a lot of people here seem to be able to run with their timing advanced by 4-6 degrees, I found that I had to bring mine all the way back to a +1 before I could eliminate the pinging under a load.� If the noise you are hearing gets louder as the RPMs increase and as the ambient temperature increases, I wouldn't rule out the fact that your timing may be advanced too far for your motor. I have also been hearing some very mild pinging as of late, when I run my Vision under a load and the adjustable timing wheel set at +4 degree's. I think I am going to go back in to it and adjust it back a bit. If your not ruining 91 octane get try it first |
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Cruiser
Posts: 53
Shelbyville, IL United States | I still am not clear on how to get the timing wheel to move or adjust. Do I have to loosen the middle bolt and the 2 outside bolts to adjust it. I had the 2 bolts out and niether part of the wheel would move. I have rode the bike 1500 miles since installing the timing wheel. The motor is so noisy how can I tell if its pining. The rattle noise is valves I would say. Taking off for 3000 mile trip I just want to make sure there is not to much timing advanced in the bike when I get to florida in 90 degree weather. The warmest I have rode it in since the timing wheel install is 75 degrees. I can either figure out how to adjust it or just take it off and put the stock timing wheel back on. The bike runs like a raped ape set at 4 degrees advanced. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 135
Chesterfield, VA | johnnyvision - 2014-04-23 7:37 PM sarvbill - 2014-04-23 6:25 AM new vic rider - 2014-04-22 11:17 PM noise gets louder the faster I go. It is rpm related. I did loosen the 2 inside bolts and it would not move either way. Matter of fact took them all the way out and it still would not move. Just trying to cover all bases on adjusting the timing wheel...you do realize that once you loosen the 2 bolts on the inner wheel, it's the inner wheel that you turn to adjust the timing and not the outer wheel that has what looks like gear teeth on it. The outer wheel is locked in place, you will not be able to turn that. Also want to point out that while a lot of people here seem to be able to run with their timing advanced by 4-6 degrees, I found that I had to bring mine all the way back to a +1 before I could eliminate the pinging under a load. If the noise you are hearing gets louder as the RPMs increase and as the ambient temperature increases, I wouldn't rule out the fact that your timing may be advanced too far for your motor. He is saying it wrong. Loosen the two outer bolts and the outer part of the wheel turns. The inner part of the wheel is stationary You're right - my bad, must be CRS kicking in again. |
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Tourer
Posts: 341
West Salem, WI United States | new vic rider - 2014-04-23 10:11 PM I still am not clear on how to get the timing wheel to move or adjust. Do I have to loosen the middle bolt and the 2 outside bolts to adjust it. I had the 2 bolts out and niether part of the wheel would move. I have rode the bike 1500 miles since installing the timing wheel. The motor is so noisy how can I tell if its pining. The rattle noise is valves I would say. Taking off for 3000 mile trip I just want to make sure there is not to much timing advanced in the bike when I get to florida in 90 degree weather. The warmest I have rode it in since the timing wheel install is 75 degrees. I can either figure out how to adjust it or just take it off and put the stock timing wheel back on. The bike runs like a raped ape set at 4 degrees advanced. If you can't get it to move, take it off and put the stock one on and see if your noise gets better. That will prove once and for all if it is the time wheel or not. Then adjust the wheel while you've got it off the bike. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1365
Central Maryland | johnnyvision - 2014-04-23 7:39 PM
If your not ruining 91 octane get try it first
Yes, I always run the Shell V-Power Premium (91-93 octane) in my Vision. I want to take it out later again this afternoon, and closely listen to it. Does sound like faint detonation, or I may just be hearing things.
If I do have to go back in the timing cover; hope the gasket from Lloydz holds up and doesn't rip. I don't have a replacement. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1365
Central Maryland | It's sounds slightly "tinky" on acceleration. I've just got done going back in and dropped the timing gear from 4+ to 2+. Hopefully I'll not have to open the timing cover again. Taking it back out for a test run.
The replacement gasket did not tear either. Was careful with it.
Edited by willtill 2014-04-24 1:25 PM
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Visionary
Posts: 1365
Central Maryland | No more "tinky" sounds that I can tell. I'll wait for hotter weather and see how she goes. Would really like to have 4+ but if 2+ is all she'll tolerate, well so be it.
Better than O |
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| new vic rider - 2014-04-23 10:11 PM I still am not clear on how to get the timing wheel to move or adjust. Do I have to loosen the middle bolt and the 2 outside bolts to adjust it. I had the 2 bolts out and niether part of the wheel would move. I have rode the bike 1500 miles since installing the timing wheel. The motor is so noisy how can I tell if its pining. The rattle noise is valves I would say. Taking off for 3000 mile trip I just want to make sure there is not to much timing advanced in the bike when I get to florida in 90 degree weather. The warmest I have rode it in since the timing wheel install is 75 degrees. I can either figure out how to adjust it or just take it off and put the stock timing wheel back on. The bike runs like a raped ape set at 4 degrees advanced. DO NOT touch center bolt. Loosen the two outer bolts. Move the outer ring. Do Not Go Below Zero |
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Cruiser
Posts: 92
Moncks Corner, SC United States | This sounds alot like when the two adjustment bolts on my timing wheel came loose shortly after install. Alot of noise coming from the top end. Found they were not (very) tight from the mfr. The fact you can't even move the adjusment wheel with the bolts out is odd. Something isn't right. I would follow the earlier post. Replace with the stock timing wheel (if you can get it off) then check for the noise. At least you will be able to eliminate something. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 255
New Brunswick , Canada | need guidance on this one...last year I started to notice a tapping sound on the first start up of the day, it lasted for about 30 sec... and for the rest of the day it was normal at start up...but gradually it has gotten worst . Year + later now on every cold start the tapping got louder and longer on warm-up for at lease 1 minute and if I rev up the motor on warm-up tap get louder to almost a knock but once she is warmed up , its quiet again . But it is getting worst with time.
No better or worst full synt or semi synt oil... is it because my oil is not getting up fast enough , how can I check if the oil pump is working with the pressure needed. How can I tell the difference between valve noise and (gulp) crank noise..Tried to locate the noise with a long screwdriver to the ear trick, but can't pin point it...
No knocking on hard accel but I can feel a vibration, everything is running smooth when she is warm up... Anything I can check before taking it to the shop...any hint would be appreciated , shop is 200 miles away..
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| LOJAK
Your lifters are bleeding down over night. They all pretty much do that. In morning when you start it the oil has to pump back into the lifters. So thats why you hear the tapping. Am guessing the time it takes for them to pump up has not changed your just scared and thinking it has. Your bike has 50 pound oil pressure when you start it and it takes a little time. You could pull your oil pressure switch and screw in a gauge and see what it reads.
If your really in doughty go to dealer or find another vision owner up there and talk to him.
Please Please till motor is warm do not rev it up your damaging the pistons doing that |
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Cruiser
Posts: 255
New Brunswick , Canada | johnnyvision - 2014-07-06 8:56 PM
LOJAK
Your lifters are bleeding down over night. They all pretty much do that. In morning when you start it the oil has to pump back into the lifters. So thats why you hear the tapping. Am guessing the time it takes for them to pump up has not changed your just scared and thinking it has. Your bike has 50 pound oil pressure when you start it and it takes a little time. You could pull your oil pressure switch and screw in a gauge and see what it reads.
If your really in doughty go to dealer or find another vision owner up there and talk to him.
Please Please till motor is warm do not rev it up your damaging the pistons doing that
Tks johnnyvision...lifters bleeding over night I could understand , but bleeding down on every cold start like 2-3 times a day compare versus 1 a day last year...would this be a sign that the bleeding is getting to be a problem ?
I assume these lifters would be hydraulic , are they !
I was thinking of doing a cam upgrade ,would this be a good time to get this lifter problem fix !! Getting tired of some of my riding friends teasing me about my motor coming apart at warm up...have to wait for the Harley's with strait pipes to start first to bury the tapping noise ,,(all in good fun ... but grrr!) |
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | at my old victory dealer they had a 09 with this issues. (A lifter) wouldn't hold oil. for that situation it required a replacement lifter. then the customer didnt have this issue any more.. i know the noise you are talking about.. mine did this to me on the very first start of this year.. it about gave me a heart attack... sounded like the bike was in self destruct mode... since then, it has not done this... |
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Tourer
Posts: 324
New Orleans, La, | I noticed that very same problem with my 08VV. I ran a couple ozs. of Berryman B 12 and Marvel Mystery oil in 4 conservative tanks and now it is cured, of course right now it is hott as heck down here in the Mardi Gras city. You also might try not starting the bike on the side stand because the oil pump pickup is at it's swallowest then. I also run a few ozs. of Marvel every other oil change. IJS that's what worked for me. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 255
New Brunswick , Canada | Tried " Sea Foam" in my oil half bottle took for a ride them flush the oil and filter. The rattle at cold start-up is 80% gone , less vibration on the floor boards and the clutch seem to grab better . Will flush again with Sea Foam at next oil change..it's a good felling , on the right track . Will try Berryman B12 in gas next...Thanks for the tips Bud's :0) |
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