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Cruiser
Posts: 181
Henlow, Bedfordshire, England | I am on my 2nd Vision now - a March 2011 silver model and know generally what to look for having been on this forum for some time (this is a brilliant resource but it hasn't half cost me some money over the years.....) so while washing the bike recently I noticed what looked like slivers inside the headlight glass and had this confirmed as cracks in the lamination, I was kind of hoping that Victory had a bad batch that had cleared the system by now. a couple miles later and the cracks are right through and looking likely that a chunk of glass may fall off. What surprised me the other day though is a crack up the windshield from one of the screws, this I am not familiar with although there is a thread about it some years ago. It is worth checking these areas regularly so it seems.
Must add that Victory and my dealer have been very good about it, sent them photos and parts are already on the way to be replaced FOC when it has its 10000 mile service soon.
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Visionary
Posts: 1229
Rancho Cucamonga, CA | Is that a tinted aftermarket windshield? What brand? |
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Cruiser
Posts: 181
Henlow, Bedfordshire, England | No it isn't unfortunately, my phone has a just acceptable camera. Makes it look good though.... |
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Tourer
Posts: 444
Bay of Gigs, WA | Prob'ly more Cheap ass parts... |
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Tourer
Posts: 554
2 mi from Jim Beam n KY | Wow! Hate it for you, but glad the dealer is hooking you up!! You might want to check your front fender while your at it. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1365
Central Maryland | Geezuz! I'm going out to eyeball my 2011 as well. WTF is making the headlight glass crack like that? |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 965
New York State | Just went out and looked over the "Glass " on my 2011 Silver and Black Vision no chips or cracks. I ride often and on some very rough surfaces I have to say the Vision is a very surefooted beast.
Thanks for the heads up.
My 2008 Vision popped both of the rubber washers on her front wind screen at about 29000 miles I was going to get replacements but Irene killed her before that happened so if you have an older Vision a look at the wind screen mounting screws from time to time is a good idea |
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Cruiser
Posts: 255
New Brunswick , Canada | Yup ...It's my 3rd headlight and the bike is not even 2 years old..
Looks like the up right corner when you are standing in front...
My 2 headlight crack at the same place..
No problem to get them change on warranty..But i don't like the idea that i'm gona
have to cough up for the next one..very expensive part. No more warranty..
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Tourer
Posts: 494
Akron Ohio area | 2011 Vision with 24,000 miles.
No cracks on windscreen, headlight, or front fender.
Knock on wood. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 763
Anderson, IN (48mi NE of downtown Indianapolis) | I see at least one cracked polycarbonate product per week returned by customers for the past 16 years. The cracks in your pics are definately the sign of chemical attack. Motorcycle owners, including me, like to clean our bikes with waxes, sprays, bug remover, window cleaner, wheel shine, chrome polish, etc. These chemicals WILL cause PC to crack, even if you don't apply it directly. Mist or vapor will cause cracks over time. Many times it starts in bolts holes like yours where the chemical gets in and never dries up. It also happens frequently at junctions between two PC parts or where it is bonded to another material. The crackes start there the same as bolt holes because the chemicals are suspended in the nooks and crannies. The cracks don't always start in tight places, though. That is just most common place for chemicals to get trapped. Cracks can happen right in the middle of the PC part too.
My guess is something spilled on the right front of your bike. I doubt it is a coincident that the windshield is cracked on the same side as the headlight at the same time? Maybe the water and squeegie at the gas station had something in it (Rain-X from the previous user???). Maybe the spill happened at the factory or during shipping. Maybe it wasn't a spill. Maybe the headlights and windshields are stored next to machining coolant at the factory and the vapor is contaminating them. Maybe the dealer sprayed something on it to wipe off the dust while it was sitting on the showroom floor.
It is very difficult to determine what causes crackes like yours because it is usually months or years ago when the PC came in contact with the offending chemical. However and whenever it happened, I can assure you those cracks are chemical attacks.
Vision owners, do not put anything on your windshield or headlight other than plain water. Please read my posting from a previous thread regarding this issue.
http://www.Vision-riders.com/bb/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=3471&pos...
I hope Victory replaces your parts since they would not be able to say without doubt that the contamination did not originate at the factory (or their vendor).
Edited by victoryvisiontour 2011-10-20 5:29 PM
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| uknessie
I would ask the dealer to replace the rubber grommets that the headlight bolts to. They might be weather checked or even harden. Just an idea.
As for chemicals causing cracks your right when I worked at a aftermarket shop we had a rash of cracked taillights it turned out the guy in back was putting a dab of blue locktight on the screws. Locktight creates heat and the taillight plastic would crack right on the edge of the holes. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 763
Anderson, IN (48mi NE of downtown Indianapolis) | Loctite is a cyanoacrylate adhesive (similar to Super Glue and Krazy Glue). Fast acting glues can haze polycarbonate very quickly and, as mentioned above, lead to cracks later. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 804
Perry Hall, MD | While the chemical damage would appear to be the most logical explanation in this case this is probably a good time to remind members not to over torque the windshield mounting bolts. Doing so can cause stress fractures to occur. |
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Tourer
Posts: 494
Akron Ohio area | Well, now I know why I don't have these problems.
I don't use any chemicals when I wash my bike and I don't wash my bike that often. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 181
Henlow, Bedfordshire, England | Lojak - 2011-10-19 10:38 PM
Yup ...It's my 3rd headlight and the bike is not even 2 years old..
Looks like the up right corner when you are standing in front...
My 2 headlight crack at the same place..
No problem to get them change on warranty..But i don't like the idea that i'm gona
have to cough up for the next one..very expensive part. No more warranty..
You are correct Lojak but the headlight has cracked the other side as well, just not right through.
Interesting about the chems, I don't wash the bike that often but do use a bug remover. Had the bike since March and washed about 5 times. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1365
Central Maryland | So... would the use of the Honda spray polish or Plexus cause aggressive chemical contamination? Or is it safe to use on the headlight and windshield? It's quite ludicrous that you can't use a cleaner on the Vision, when it's supposed to be designed for surfaces just like that. |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 48
Simpsonville, SC | Not to jack the thread, but maybe victoryvisiontour is on to something here.
I have a question for all of you with cracked front fenders, "what do you use to polish and/ or wash your bike?" Could they somehow be putting a chemical on the front fender that reacts with the material at the mounting bolts leading to cracks? |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 48
Simpsonville, SC | BTW, I only use Turtle wax Ice products and water on my Vision. No cracks on windshield, headlight, or front fender after 1 year of ownership. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 1109
| I use Ice on my bike too if I want a quick shine. But about every other month I use a good carnauba wax and I've never had a problem. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1350
| Interesting note on the chemical contamination. I have used Novus http://www.novuspolish.com/ for years now with no cracks or other visible damage. I knew about not using products that contained ammonia on plexiglass. I have posted about carefully using a heat gun to remove scratches. (this was from information I found on the bomb squad guys scratching their shields) We have been using it here at work since I found out about it years ago. We don't throw out any damaged plexiglass anymore.
I have also used automatic dishwasher liquid without any damage over the years on plexiglass.
We just keep learning. |
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Tourer
Posts: 492
Indianapolis, IN | lennyb - 2011-10-20 7:38 PM While the chemical damage would appear to be the most logical explanation in this case this is probably a good time to remind members not to over torque the windshield mounting bolts. Doing so can cause stress fractures to occur. I agree with not over tightening. I lost a wind shield screw and nut the other day and had to order a replacement. When I installed I found that there is no "stop" in the design of the screw, so it is possible to put way too much pressure on the plastic at the mounting holes. My solution was to remove all the screws one at a time and re-install with a dab of blue loc-tite on the threads to prevent vibrating loose, and then tightened them down till they were just snug. I work with polycarbinate a lot in my job and it is very easy to over stress this "unbreakable" material at fastener points. A temporary fix until you can get a new shield is to make sure that fastener is not too tight and then drill a very small hole in the plastic right at the end of the crack. This should relieve the stress and buy you some time without the crack getting any worse. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 763
Anderson, IN (48mi NE of downtown Indianapolis) | Drilling a 1l4" hole at the end of the crack definitely helps the crack from spreading. It relieves the stress at the single point and spreads it around the circumference of the hole. Obviously the hole looks bad, but a crack all the way across the windshield or fender looks worse. I always suggest placing a decal, such as Vision Riders, over the hole until the part can be replaced. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 802
| In my shop I have an automatic cutoff saw with a Lexan hood which uses a synthetic coolant. For the first couple of years I had it I used to leave the hood closed when it was idle. The left over mist from the coolant ended up cracking the hood in about 100 places. Since figuring out what was causing the cracks I now leave it open so it can vent when not being used. No new cracks. It also destroyed the plastic electrical covers inside the machine. I replaced them and haven't had any problems since. Plastics and certain chemicals definitely don't get along.
Marc |
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Tourer
Posts: 444
Bay of Gigs, WA | Chemicals now? Geez. Talk about one more thing that never occurred to me... |
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Cruiser
Posts: 181
Henlow, Bedfordshire, England | Although both are being replaced under warranty I will stop using some cleaners and see what happens, have to say though that my last Vision was 3 years old, cleaned exactly the same way and no problems. |
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Tourer
Posts: 599
New Mexico | rainryder - 2011-10-21 6:20 PM
Chemicals now? Geez. Talk about one more thing that never occurred to me...
Although I use a lot of products to keep the bike clean (Simple Green, Turtle Wax Ice car wash & wax, Nevr-Dull, Eagle One Wheel Cleaner, etc) this is all I use on my windshield. Keep a small bottle with me for quick touch-ups.
http://www.purevictorypolishes.com/product/90956
Their "Black and Silver Engine Enhancer" is also a great product. Was amazed! Just spray on and let it dry.
Edited by Boots 2011-10-22 9:36 AM
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Tourer
Posts: 494
Akron Ohio area | I also use the above Victory branded product. ($14 I think)
I bought the bottle almost a year ago and still have some left.
It does a good job on all surfaces. |
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | Since victory doesnt make their own chemicals, i wonder whos rebadged product that is?? |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 39
Georgia | I have cleaned my windscreen twice since taking delivery, I have yet to clean the entire bike but will soon. I have used Plexus both times, I typically use Plexus on my LCD TV, face shields, helmets, sunglass lenses.......someone please tell me if Plexus is safe for the Vision Windscreen and headlight. I have always considered Plexus as the one of the safest plastic cleaners available and if it isn't safe for the Vision then what would be the best option.
Thanx for any advise offered or the effort in confirming that Plexus is A-OK on the Visions plastics. |
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Tourer
Posts: 599
New Mexico | Arkainzeye - 2011-10-22 9:13 AM
Since victory doesnt make their own chemicals, i wonder whos rebadged product that is??
From reading their website I don't think it is 'rebadged'. Appears they developed their products for their detailing business, then started distributing. The products are "Polaris Licensed Merchandise" that I purchase at my local Victory dealership..
I also noticed when the 'Fuel It' truck arrived with the 2012 bikes they were using these products.
Lastly, they have a link to Vision-Riders on their website, so must be good folks :-)
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Iron Butt
Posts: 785
Mt. Vernon, WASH. | The key to cleaning and polishing any plastic glazing is don't go in circles! Wipe the surface in straight up and down overlapping strokes, Wiping in circles will create those irritating solar flashes like you'd see in a cheezy TV desert scenes which will give you a headache, also don't scrub tough spots, it creates ugly frosted spots, you learn that stuff wiping windshields on light airplanes.
Cracking usually is a sign that something is binding or under abnormal pressure from poor or forced installation or excessive tightening, uneven tightening, or openings that are fractionally smaller which puts pressure point preload on the parts and the weaker or softer part suffers the most.
Just because you've got room for the 18 inch breaker bar doesn't mean it's wise to use it! 'tighten it till it catches fire and back it off till it's smoking' is not a good plan
Edited by SYNSTR 2011-10-22 11:06 AM
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Tourer
Posts: 575
Spirit Lake IA "Birthplace of Victory Motorcycles" | I spent years being in the automotive lighting industry in jobs ranging from production supervisor to plant manager. Polycarbonates are amazing materials, but all materials have built in stress when they are injection molded, especially between the mold gates Too much moisture in material (or not enough), how much regrind they are using (or if at all) mold temps, etc will effect the overall quality and brittleness of the final product. So, there are quite a few variables to contend with. On top of that, as has been stated, excessive torquing on fasteners and chemicals will cause the stresses already in the plastics to reach the literal breaking point. Road debris can also add to the equation. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 255
New Brunswick , Canada | Lojak - 2011-10-20 6:38 PM
Yup ...It's my 3rd headlight and the bike is not even 2 years old..
Looks like the up right corner when you are standing in front...
My 2 headlight crack at the same place..
No problem to get them change on warranty..But i don't like the idea that i'm gona
have to cough up for the next one..very expensive part. No more warranty..
After writing this...i went to check my headlight...it's CRACK AGAIN.. This
is the 3rd light in 18 months. Two this last 6 months alone..Pearl White 2010 Vision.
As much that i like this bike.. i will not cough up a $1000.00 a year on headlights.
It's up to the dealer now to convince me to keep this bike..I&^*)(*&&)(* |
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Tourer
Posts: 554
2 mi from Jim Beam n KY | Plexus is fine.
Please use microfiber towels on your windshields..........and wipe slowly........ |
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Visionary
Posts: 1365
Central Maryland | I am wondering if heat from the twin halogen bulbs has anything to do with this? They are in close proximity to each other. Excessive heat in the headlamp assembly and then the cold from the outside....? |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 763
Anderson, IN (48mi NE of downtown Indianapolis) | With as many cracked headlights as there are, I would guess it is something in the manufacturing, inventory, or shipping process. The plastic is coming in contact with an incompatible chemical somewhere along the line. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 255
New Brunswick , Canada | Lojak - 2011-10-23 4:10 PM
Lojak - 2011-10-20 6:38 PM
Yup ...It's my 3rd headlight and the bike is not even 2 years old..
Looks like the up right corner when you are standing in front...
My 2 headlight crack at the same place..
No problem to get them change on warranty..But i don't like the idea that i'm gona
have to cough up for the next one..very expensive part. No more warranty..
After writing this...i went to check my headlight...it's CRACK AGAIN.. This
is the 3rd light in 18 months. Two this last 6 months alone..Pearl White 2010 Vision.
As much that i like this bike.. i will not cough up a $1000.00 a year on headlights.
It's up to the dealer now to convince me to keep this bike..I&^*)(*&&)(*
Something has change...according to the parts deptment of my dealer . the part # for the 2012 Vision is not
the same as the previous years...Maybe something has change in the design !!!! |
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Cruiser
Posts: 181
Henlow, Bedfordshire, England | Lojak - 2011-10-23 12:42 AM
Lojak - 2011-10-23 4:10 PM
Lojak - 2011-10-20 6:38 PM
Yup ...It's my 3rd headlight and the bike is not even 2 years old..
Looks like the up right corner when you are standing in front...
My 2 headlight crack at the same place..
No problem to get them change on warranty..But i don't like the idea that i'm gona
have to cough up for the next one..very expensive part. No more warranty..
After writing this...i went to check my headlight...it's CRACK AGAIN.. This
is the 3rd light in 18 months. Two this last 6 months alone..Pearl White 2010 Vision.
As much that i like this bike.. i will not cough up a $1000.00 a year on headlights.
It's up to the dealer now to convince me to keep this bike..I&^*)(*&&)(*
Something has change...according to the parts deptment of my dealer . the part # for the 2012 Vision is not
the same as the previous years...Maybe something has change in the design !!!!
It has changed, there is no longer a third lamp or the option for a HID in the 3rd place. That is if its the same as the UK spec ones. The lamp looks the same from the front but there is no hole behind or fittings. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 71
Bayonne, NJ | Windshield crack is due to over tightning the bolts. you may not think you have tighted it to much but trust me that is the issue. happens all the time on harleys. You have to stop turning once the bolt gets snug not tight. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 763
Anderson, IN (48mi NE of downtown Indianapolis) | This is a list I put together of substances known to harm polycarbonate. The source is a combination of my own professional experience, other professionals in the same industry, and actual test data from all of us. This not a comprehensive list. These are only the chemicals someone or myself has witnessed damage to PC.
Note that you may come in contact with many of these substances while servicing or cleaning your bike (gasoline, Loctite, ammonia (found in surface&glass cleaner), etc).
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